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wandering_not_lost's review against another edition
medium-paced
1.5
I was hoping that this book would give me more of what I liked about Caves of Steel (the solid sense of place in a skewed future world, some interesting robots) but less of what I hated (the world's worst detectiving and being unable to follow the trail of evidence if it was on fire, plus bonus casual sexism). Boy, was I disappointed.
I mean, it DID have an interesting world, and a really masterful extrapolation of the psychological and sociological aspects of both Baley's having lived underground all his life and the Solarians' living essentially in isolation all theirs. The seeing vs. viewing distinction, for all that it was a setup for figuring out the "mystery", was well-woven into all the interactions, which was neat to see. Baley's agoraphobia was also...well, mostly interesting to see interact with his new environment. It was also an opportunity for him to do a few very dumb childish things, and it was presented as something that he just had to power through through force of will, which wasn't the best look in modern times.
And I guess that starts the list of where the book failed for me. First, poor Daneel got even less screentime in this, and was mostly (and literally sometimes) used as a prop in a way that I guess is on me: I personalize my robot characters, sorry not sorry. I get the feeling from Asimov that I'm not supposed to, but I DO, and Baley treats Daneel terribly in this book. It (probably unintentionally) made me dislike Baley more.
Second, the mystery kind of held promise most of the way through the book - and then just absolutely tanked in the reveal. I'm not good at figuring out mysteries, and this one I solved one aspect of it way before Baley did, and with less "evidence". Once again, Baley just...was ALL over the place whenever he had a crime to investigate.He has one murder taking place with a malfunctioning robot in the room, and he didn't immediately wonder "gee, where did the robot come from? What was its deal?" Then he watched remotely as a guy drank some poisoned water and did not IMMEDIATELY jump to "tell me everywhere that water and glass have been and who touched them", instead just focusing on "the tap might be poisoned!" uuuugh. And even worse than the first time, I felt like the reveal didn't hold together. I was not convinced that Baley knew what he was talking about when he brought everyone together for the reveal, and it was kind of a letdown that he was correct, because it felt like such lazy writing.
Not to mention, how Baley wrapped things up just stank of even worse sexism than the first book. I'll forgive the male gaze aspect of "oh ho, tee hee, this culture just is fine with casual nudity when viewing remotely, so here, let's give married man Baley some gratuitous pretty lady nudity to ogle", because I'm sure that it was more revolutionary nearly 70 years ago. But I do not excusea POLICE OFFICER letting a murderer go. Not just a "she beat him to death in a rage" murderer but also a "manipulated the police officer into an 'accident' that would have been cold-blooded murder as well" murderer. All because "she was manipulated into it because someone else gave her the weapon, and boo hoo, she's SO SAD, and was SO HORNY for her husband who didn't love her, and look, all she needs is a more suitably liberated sexual environment and surely she won't ever MURDER ANYONE AGAIN and-" NO. That does not make her harmless or excuse what she did! TWICE! Sexism strikes again in the guise of bad characterization and decisions that don't even make sense unless the author/reader thinks that women are incredibly dumb and fragile and helpless.
So yeah. 1.5. Not even an "it was ok". Which is sad because there really are some interesting ideas underlying it all.
I mean, it DID have an interesting world, and a really masterful extrapolation of the psychological and sociological aspects of both Baley's having lived underground all his life and the Solarians' living essentially in isolation all theirs. The seeing vs. viewing distinction, for all that it was a setup for figuring out the "mystery", was well-woven into all the interactions, which was neat to see. Baley's agoraphobia was also...well, mostly interesting to see interact with his new environment. It was also an opportunity for him to do a few very dumb childish things, and it was presented as something that he just had to power through through force of will, which wasn't the best look in modern times.
And I guess that starts the list of where the book failed for me. First, poor Daneel got even less screentime in this, and was mostly (and literally sometimes) used as a prop in a way that I guess is on me: I personalize my robot characters, sorry not sorry. I get the feeling from Asimov that I'm not supposed to, but I DO, and Baley treats Daneel terribly in this book. It (probably unintentionally) made me dislike Baley more.
Second, the mystery kind of held promise most of the way through the book - and then just absolutely tanked in the reveal. I'm not good at figuring out mysteries, and this one I solved one aspect of it way before Baley did, and with less "evidence". Once again, Baley just...was ALL over the place whenever he had a crime to investigate.
Not to mention, how Baley wrapped things up just stank of even worse sexism than the first book. I'll forgive the male gaze aspect of "oh ho, tee hee, this culture just is fine with casual nudity when viewing remotely, so here, let's give married man Baley some gratuitous pretty lady nudity to ogle", because I'm sure that it was more revolutionary nearly 70 years ago. But I do not excuse
So yeah. 1.5. Not even an "it was ok". Which is sad because there really are some interesting ideas underlying it all.
Content Warnings
Moderate: Sexism and Suicide
Both agoraphobia and haphephobia described. Also someone badgered into suicide.rnewhook's review
adventurous
dark
mysterious
slow-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Plot
- Strong character development? Yes
- Loveable characters? It's complicated
- Diverse cast of characters? No
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
3.5
Content Warnings
Minor: Suicide
obtoosegoose's review against another edition
adventurous
hopeful
reflective
medium-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? A mix
- Strong character development? It's complicated
- Loveable characters? It's complicated
- Diverse cast of characters? No
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
4.0
Content Warnings
Graphic: Suicide and Murder
velociraptor's review against another edition
adventurous
mysterious
medium-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Plot
- Strong character development? Yes
- Loveable characters? Yes
- Diverse cast of characters? No
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
4.0
Content Warnings
Graphic: Panic attacks/disorders and Suicide
Moderate: Sexual content and Murder
Minor: Sexism and Infidelity
alrauna's review
adventurous
challenging
mysterious
reflective
medium-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Plot
- Strong character development? Yes
- Loveable characters? Yes
- Diverse cast of characters? No
- Flaws of characters a main focus? No
4.0
Content Warnings
Graphic: Panic attacks/disorders and Suicide
Moderate: Murder
Minor: Infertility
misslescano's review against another edition
adventurous
mysterious
tense
fast-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Plot
- Loveable characters? It's complicated
- Diverse cast of characters? No
- Flaws of characters a main focus? No
4.5
4.5**
• Desenvolvimento da Trama: o desenvolvimento da história é ótimo, o ritmo da leitura flui muito bem e o mistério conseguiu manter-se até o momento da revelação para mim.
• Personagens: os personagens não são extremamente complexos, mas, para o propósito da história, funcionam muito bem. A história é definitivamente mais focada no enredo do que nos personagens.
• Universo da história: muito bem arquitetado, desde as cavernas até o centro de análise de embriões é absolutamente crível. A presença constante de sociólogos no livro #1 e #2 acabou enriquecendo muitíssimo a história e, como uma fã de Sociologia, fiquei satisfeita e feliz com a inclusão de análises sobre as sociedades Terráquea e Solariana.
• Narrativa (estilo de escrita): fácil de entender, mas não é pobre e extremamente simples.
• Final: meticulosamente planejado e bem feito, deixou-me curiosa para ler o próxim livro.
Minha única reclamação é algumas cenas específicas que me deixaram meio desconfortável e preferiria que tivessem sido feitas de outra forma, mas, no geral, é um livro muito bom.
• Desenvolvimento da Trama: o desenvolvimento da história é ótimo, o ritmo da leitura flui muito bem e o mistério conseguiu manter-se até o momento da revelação para mim.
• Personagens: os personagens não são extremamente complexos, mas, para o propósito da história, funcionam muito bem. A história é definitivamente mais focada no enredo do que nos personagens.
• Universo da história: muito bem arquitetado, desde as cavernas até o centro de análise de embriões é absolutamente crível. A presença constante de sociólogos no livro #1 e #2 acabou enriquecendo muitíssimo a história e, como uma fã de Sociologia, fiquei satisfeita e feliz com a inclusão de análises sobre as sociedades Terráquea e Solariana.
• Narrativa (estilo de escrita): fácil de entender, mas não é pobre e extremamente simples.
• Final: meticulosamente planejado e bem feito, deixou-me curiosa para ler o próxim livro.
Minha única reclamação é algumas cenas específicas que me deixaram meio desconfortável e preferiria que tivessem sido feitas de outra forma, mas, no geral, é um livro muito bom.
Content Warnings
Graphic: Suicide, Medical content, and Panic attacks/disorders
Minor: Infidelity and Murder
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