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blearywitch's review against another edition
3.0
How do you choose a husband?
I shall take the first that comes after I have quite made up my mind... After all, a husband is very mich like a house or a horse. You don't take your house because it's the best house in the world, but because just then you want a house. You go and see a house, and if it's very nasty you don't take it. But if you think it will suit pretty well, and if you're tired of looking about for houses, you do take it. That's the way one buys one's horses - and one's husbands. - Violet Effingham
Phineas, Lord Chiltern, and Mr. Kennedy seem to be the main male lovers in this episode. However, they are an absolute contrast to Mr. Grey.
It is not as dramatic, and as spellbinding as "Can You Forgive Her?" but it held my interest and was well-written, of course.
I shall take the first that comes after I have quite made up my mind... After all, a husband is very mich like a house or a horse. You don't take your house because it's the best house in the world, but because just then you want a house. You go and see a house, and if it's very nasty you don't take it. But if you think it will suit pretty well, and if you're tired of looking about for houses, you do take it. That's the way one buys one's horses - and one's husbands. - Violet Effingham
Phineas, Lord Chiltern, and Mr. Kennedy seem to be the main male lovers in this episode. However, they are an absolute contrast to Mr. Grey.
It is not as dramatic, and as spellbinding as "Can You Forgive Her?" but it held my interest and was well-written, of course.
burritapal_1's review against another edition
challenging
emotional
hopeful
informative
reflective
sad
slow-paced
3.0
This is probably my least favorite Trollope novel. Nevertheless, it gets 3 stars because Trollope is just such a fabulous novelist and has such magnificent command of language. The development of and actions of his characters is extremely realistic. They evoke emotions from the reader in sympathy, laughter, and, at times, disgust.
The reason it is not my favorite is because of all the politics in it, which I find boring. These are English politics, and American politics are certainly annoying, but at least I can relate to who they're talking about. If I had been around in 1850s, and 1860s England, then I'd know what and who Trollope was talking about. However, it is valuable in that it makes the reader understand much more than they originally did about how Parliament works. The only one that I've ever heard of is Disraeli, just because it's such a strange name, and the politician Daubeny was purportedly modeled after Disraeli. Phineas Finn himself has been proposed as the model for Chichester parkinson-Fortescue, About whom I know nothing.
The location of the novel is for a majority spent in the palace of Westminster where all the politics takes place, but there are also ministries, political clubs, private salons, and dining rooms in London.
The novel starts in Ireland, where Phineas comes from, And also goes to the Highlands of Scotland and a provincial English borough; it also spends time in the hunting counties of Midland England, which part I hated.
Phineas is the only son of a successful Irish doctor who sends him to London to study under a barrister. He's not that great of a student, but because he's handsome and has a likable character, he makes many friends, and one of them proves to be helpful to him. That's Barrington Erle, who is the private secretary to a politician, and he convinces Phineas to run as MP for a small borough in England and Phineas actually wins this seat, because of a quirk of luck.
The lawyer who had tutored Phineas is almost like a father to him, so when he lets Mr. Low know that he's going in for Parliament, Mr. Low is angry with him. He tells Phineas that he's going about Politics the wrong way around. Phineas keeps telling everybody that he can take this risk of taking a job with no pay because there's nobody dependent on him. When Mr. Low reads this part of Phineas's letter to him, he snorts
"...'no one dependent on him! Are not his father and his mother and his sisters dependent on him as long as he must eat their bread till he can earn bread of his own? He will never earn bread of his own. He will always be eating bread that others have earned.'..." lol
There's no income attached to this seat, so Phineas's father reluctantly agrees to give him 250 pounds a year to support him, while he gets upon his legs as a politician. It takes a while, but get on his legs he does, much with the help of Lady Laura Standish, the daughter of an Earl who is a Tory in Parliament.
Phineas comes to love Lady Laura, despite having a girlfriend back home in Ireland. But Phineas is penniless, and Lady Laura doesn't have much money herself, because she bails out her brother Lord Chiltern, who is a ruffian, and earlier had been a drunk and a gambler.
When Phineas is about to ask Lady Laura to be his wife, she jumps the gun and tells Phineas that she has agreed to marry Robert Kennedy, a rich politician. But Robert Kennedy is a dry, cold man with no humor. And this marriage becomes Lady Laura's ball and chain.
Mr. Kennedy has certain ideas about what a wife should be like, and Lady Laura is nothing like this. he thinks a wife should go twice to church on Sunday with her husband, and should never read books on Sunday. Lady Laura Chafes against this and eventually stops Doing as he wishes. When he wants her to go with him to church on a Sunday, she starts getting headaches. Mr. Kennedy enrages Lady Laura by sending for the country doctor whenever this happens.
" 'I will send for Doctor McNuthrie at once,' said Mr. Kennedy, walking toward the door very slowly, and speaking as slowly as he walked.
'no; - do no such thing,' she said, Springing to her feet again and intercepting him before he reached the door. 'if he comes I will not see him. I give you my word that I will not speak to him if he comes. You do not understand,' she said; 'you do not understand at all.'
'what is it that I ought to understand?' he asked.
'that a woman does not like to be bothered.'
he made no reply at once, but stood there twisting the handle of the door, and collecting his thoughts. 'yes,' said he at last; 'I am beginning to find that out; - and to find out also what it is that bothers a woman, as you call it. I can see now what it is that makes your head ache. It is not the stomach. You are quite right there. It is the prospect of a quiet decent life, to which would be attached the performance of certain homely duties. Doctor McNuthrie is a learned man, but I doubt whether he can do anything for such a malady.'
'you are quite right, Robert; he can do nothing.'
'it is a malady you must cure for yourself, Laura; - and which is to be cured by perseverance. If you can bring yourself to try - '
'but I cannot bring myself to try at all,' she said."
Now Phineas turns his love interest towards Violet Effingham, Lady Laura's best friend. Violet Effingham has many suitors proposing marriage to her, and she cracks me up when she's talking to Lady Laura about choosing a husband:
"...'after all, a husband is very much like a house or a horse. You don't take your house because it's the best house in the world, but because just then you want a house. You go and see a house, and if it's very nasty you don't take it. But if you think it will suit pretty well, and if you are tired of looking about for houses, you do take it. That's The way one buys one's horses,-and one's husbands.' "
Yeah, Me Too, Violet, but that didn't work out too well for me.
Violet Effingham has a fortune herself, and she's loved Lord Chiltern all her life since they were children together. Lady Laura wants nothing better than to have Violet and Oswald, her brother, Marry.
Lord Chiltern and Phineas have become good friends, but when Lord Chiltern learns that Phineas has expressed an interest in Violet, he gets furious and proposes a duel. Amazingly enough, these 2 ridiculous characters go to Brussels and fight a duel, where I suppose it's legal. Nobody dies, but Phineas gets shot in his shoulder, and it)))) takes him a while to get better and come back to London. Nobody is supposed to know about this, and indeed those who do keep it quiet for some time.
Phineas and Robert Kennedy are in Parliament together, and know each other well, because of lady Laura. However, they're not that close, as nobody can get along with this old fuddy-duddy. One night they're leaving Parliament together, and as they part ways, Phineas notices 2 shadowy characters trailing Kennedy. He intervenes when they try to Garrote him, and so earns much praise and good feelings from among other politicians and friends and family of Lady Laura and Kennedy. Indeed, Lady Laura's father, Lord Brentford, offers Phineas the seat for the "pocket borough" of Laughton, where the family estate is.
Though Phineas has saved Kennedy's life, it drives a wedge between Kennedy and his wife, because he's jealous of the attention that Lady Laura pays him. Their marriage, which hasn't been very good up to this time, now becomes exceedingly difficult for Lady Laura, and she becomes ill and depressed, and eventually dumps his ass and goes back to live with her father.
"...He was a man terribly in fear of the world's good opinion, who lacked the courage to go through a great and harassing trial in order that something better might come afterwards. His married life had been unhappy. His wife had not submitted either to his will or to his ways. He had that great desire to enjoy his full rights, so strong in the minds of weak, ambitious men, and he had told himself that a wife's obedience was one of those rights which he could not abandon without injury to his self-esteem. He had thought about the matter, slowly, as was his wont, and had resolved that he would assert himself. He had asserted himself, and his wife had told him to his face that she would go away and leave him. He could detain her legally, but he could not do even that without the fact of such forcible detention being known to all the world..."
Yeah, this Kennedy dude reminds me somewhat of my ex-husband, trying to force his idea of what a wife should be on somebody, and thus he kills any love that she might have had for the pendejo.
Phineas asks Violet Effingham to be his wife, and she turns him down and eventually gets together with Lord Chiltern.
Now there's another woman on the scene, madame Max Goesler, who is a wealthy widow, who is also beautiful and young. She lets Phineas know that she would like to be his wife, but at the last minute, Phineas decides to go back with his old girlfriend from his Irish Hometown.
I was disappointed in the ending; I wanted Phineas to get together with Madame Max.
richardr's review against another edition
5.0
Trollope described himself as a 'conservative liberal' and that perhaps accounts for some of what I felt uneasy about in the first of the Palliser novels, Can Your Forgive Her. In that case, it sympathetically treated the desires for its female characters for more autonomy, only to ultimately deny them. The same issues recur in Phineas Finn; coming from a background that is neither upper-class nor English, Finn in many ways serves as a vehicle for criticising much of English society, arguing that the role of government should be to reduce inequalities. For example, Trollope notes the parasitic quality of aristocrats like Lord Chiltern who refuse to do any work for a living, in contrast to the work ethic Phineas displays throughout. But Trollope's criticism is offset by the lack of sympathy shown for more radical causes in the novel, as with his treatment of the riot provoked by the character of Turnbull ("there can be no doubt he was wrong in what he was doing"). Trollope heavily implies that he sees characters like Monk and Turnbull as preferring opposition to working for incremental reform from within, a problem that has remained in leftwing politics since. Much of the depictions of Parliamentary life in the novel consist of liberal governments being unable to pass reforming legislation due to it being insufficiently radical for that wing of their party. The only voices given to the English working class in the novel is Mr Bunce, a character described as 'an unhappy man because he suffered from poltical grievances.. that were semi-political and semi-social."
One exception to this ambivalence is Ireland. Ireland is not a subject often treated of in Victorian literature and when it is (as with Barry Lyndon) it isn't necessarily with any sympathy. Trollope is unusual here in both knowing the subject well and treating it with sympathy; "it was incumbent on England to force upon Ireland the maintenance of the union... because England could not afford independence established." The central plot of the novel accordingly deals with the failure to reform injustices like tenants rights in Ireland and it is probably the one point where Trollope is least equivocal in critiquing the establishment.
Phineas is also in a position not entirely unlike Alice in the previous novel, in this case faced with choices over choosing marriage for love or for social advancement. But unlike Alice, such issues end up addressed with duels rather than private anguish and as one character notes; "It is so different with a man! A woman is wretched if she does not love her husband, but I fancy that a man gets on very well without any such feeling." The novel does briefly allude to Mill's attempt to establish voting rights for women but as with Alice, characters like Lady Standish retreat away from breaking up their unhappy marriages back to reconciliation with their husband in spite of having identified a position where "she had married a richman in order that she might be able to do something in the world and now that she was this rich man's wife she found she could do nothing." The advocacy of votes for women by Madame Goesler represents the most marked challenge to the status quo in the novel; "what would I not give to be a member of the British Parliament at such a moment as this!" but her status is made more difficult by being an Austrian Jew; "She had invited this woman down... the widow of a jew banker.. a jewess whose habits of life and manners of thought they were all absolutely ignorant." Trollope's authorial voice rebukes this anti-semitism as unjust and Glencora apologises later; but the marriage into the English aristocracy that had provoked this reaction falls nontheless. Her views on disestablishing the church and the right to strike consequently end up marked as foreign and essentially un-English. This implication actually recurs throughout, as in this depiction of Turnbull; "others said that Mr Turnbull was a demagogue and at heart a rebel; that he was un-English, false and very dangerous."
One exception to this ambivalence is Ireland. Ireland is not a subject often treated of in Victorian literature and when it is (as with Barry Lyndon) it isn't necessarily with any sympathy. Trollope is unusual here in both knowing the subject well and treating it with sympathy; "it was incumbent on England to force upon Ireland the maintenance of the union... because England could not afford independence established." The central plot of the novel accordingly deals with the failure to reform injustices like tenants rights in Ireland and it is probably the one point where Trollope is least equivocal in critiquing the establishment.
Phineas is also in a position not entirely unlike Alice in the previous novel, in this case faced with choices over choosing marriage for love or for social advancement. But unlike Alice, such issues end up addressed with duels rather than private anguish and as one character notes; "It is so different with a man! A woman is wretched if she does not love her husband, but I fancy that a man gets on very well without any such feeling." The novel does briefly allude to Mill's attempt to establish voting rights for women but as with Alice, characters like Lady Standish retreat away from breaking up their unhappy marriages back to reconciliation with their husband in spite of having identified a position where "she had married a richman in order that she might be able to do something in the world and now that she was this rich man's wife she found she could do nothing." The advocacy of votes for women by Madame Goesler represents the most marked challenge to the status quo in the novel; "what would I not give to be a member of the British Parliament at such a moment as this!" but her status is made more difficult by being an Austrian Jew; "She had invited this woman down... the widow of a jew banker.. a jewess whose habits of life and manners of thought they were all absolutely ignorant." Trollope's authorial voice rebukes this anti-semitism as unjust and Glencora apologises later; but the marriage into the English aristocracy that had provoked this reaction falls nontheless. Her views on disestablishing the church and the right to strike consequently end up marked as foreign and essentially un-English. This implication actually recurs throughout, as in this depiction of Turnbull; "others said that Mr Turnbull was a demagogue and at heart a rebel; that he was un-English, false and very dangerous."
lbrex's review against another edition
5.0
This was an excellent novel that, though less dramatic and sensational than _The Way We Live Now_, tells quite a gripping story about a young Irishman, Phineas Finn, who is trained in the law but, rather than becoming a barrister, commences his career by representing his home in the British House of Commons. This isn't something, though, that comes with a salary, so, though he is elated to take public office and join a respected legislative body, he is not economically self-sufficient.
The great question of the book is how whether he can make a living for himself and serve in parliament. Because one solution to Phineas's problem would be to take a wife with money, the courtship narratives here are woven into the parliamentary narrative. The reader gets to learn about, for instance, Phineas's first attempt to speak in the House (Trollope does a great job rendering his psychology here), while also hearing about his four main love interests: his young and ever-faithful Irish lover, Mary Flood Jones, his political ally and daughter to an Earl, Laura Standish, a wealthy heiress who seems to have trouble knowing her own mind, Violet Effingham, and a rich widow with a knack of befriending everyone, Mme. Max Goesler.
Trollope manages to keep the reader turning the pages while also bringing up some interesting questions about politics, such as what one can do when one's views go against one's political party, whether a legislator's independence is more important than public service, whether financial resources and political power are good reasons to get married, and whether it's okay to benefit from an unjust system even when you are trying to reform the very same system.
This book really captured my imagination. I may need to keep reading the Palliser novels!
The great question of the book is how whether he can make a living for himself and serve in parliament. Because one solution to Phineas's problem would be to take a wife with money, the courtship narratives here are woven into the parliamentary narrative. The reader gets to learn about, for instance, Phineas's first attempt to speak in the House (Trollope does a great job rendering his psychology here), while also hearing about his four main love interests: his young and ever-faithful Irish lover, Mary Flood Jones, his political ally and daughter to an Earl, Laura Standish, a wealthy heiress who seems to have trouble knowing her own mind, Violet Effingham, and a rich widow with a knack of befriending everyone, Mme. Max Goesler.
Trollope manages to keep the reader turning the pages while also bringing up some interesting questions about politics, such as what one can do when one's views go against one's political party, whether a legislator's independence is more important than public service, whether financial resources and political power are good reasons to get married, and whether it's okay to benefit from an unjust system even when you are trying to reform the very same system.
This book really captured my imagination. I may need to keep reading the Palliser novels!
jakebittle's review against another edition
This is a long book about a boring Irish guy who succeeds in Parliament because he's really hot, tries and fails to get married to three women, then resigns Parliament because he believes Irish tenants deserve rights. I know it sounds terrible, but it's actually so good—a cosmological depiction of how money moves people, moves on behalf of people, moves between and underneath people. As in Can You Forgive Her?, Trollope is trying to figure out whether political life is noble or ignoble, and whether politicians are the best people or the worst people. As a result the book represents both an embodiment and a savage criticism of what might be called "the liberal imagination" or even "the reformist imagination"—the idea that it is possible for people to better the world by debating principles and enacting laws. You and I might like to believe this is possible, but then you meet the people involved—embittered lords, idiotic duchesses, stodgy heirs to Scottish factories—and you have to reconsider.
manwithanagenda's review against another edition
lighthearted
reflective
slow-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Character
- Strong character development? Yes
- Loveable characters? Yes
- Diverse cast of characters? No
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
3.0
Phineas Finn follows 'Can You Forgive Her?' in Trollope's series of "Parliamentary" novels that are linked by Plantagenet and Glencora Palliser. This is the first one to really dig into the nitty-gritty of politics and the thrill of legislative processes. It actually is interesting, especially as I had very little idea of how the election process worked in the United Kingdom (then, or now).
The Penguin Classics edition has a thorough introduction (that should be read afterwards, naturally) and exhaustive notes concerning Trollope's manuscript and highlighting the to-the-minute real influences incorporated into the novel. I love that someone has researched the articles Trollope was reading and editing at the time he was writing and noted his attempts to forecast in his novels. Trollope was so prolific and so attuned to society his books are an archive of fashions, language and trivia of the mid-Victorian era.
What about the novel itself? I liked it enough - the extra politics was fascinating - but there was a huge flaw. I never believed Phineas was in love. I never believed Violet Effingham was in love. I didn't believe in the romance of any of the characters except for, perhaps, Lady Laura. That's a huge flaw, and if it were not for the fact that I nevertheless enjoyed this novel a LOT more than 'He Knew He Was Right', I'd be rating this lower.
Phineas Finn is a young Irishman who has studied the law and has a minor flirtation with the Girl Back Home who he proceeds to never think about for years at a time. He is made the protege of a young noblewoman interested in politics and at an incredibly young age is elected into the House of Commons. He is slightly corrupted, goes to parties, shilly-shallies, and the like. He is a good seat on a horse and handsome enough for the ladies. The plot of the novel surrounds Phineas' coming to terms with what is honorable and what is right in government and must make hard choices for his future. There are subplots involving a duel in Brussels and several potential marriages, but this is a shockingly focused novel. A pity, like I said, I never believed in Phineas' heart. I'll have to see what becomes of him in 'Phineas Redux'.
The Pallisers
Next: 'The Eustace Diamonds'
Previous: 'Can You Forgive Her?'
The Penguin Classics edition has a thorough introduction (that should be read afterwards, naturally) and exhaustive notes concerning Trollope's manuscript and highlighting the to-the-minute real influences incorporated into the novel. I love that someone has researched the articles Trollope was reading and editing at the time he was writing and noted his attempts to forecast in his novels. Trollope was so prolific and so attuned to society his books are an archive of fashions, language and trivia of the mid-Victorian era.
What about the novel itself? I liked it enough - the extra politics was fascinating - but there was a huge flaw. I never believed Phineas was in love. I never believed Violet Effingham was in love. I didn't believe in the romance of any of the characters except for, perhaps, Lady Laura. That's a huge flaw, and if it were not for the fact that I nevertheless enjoyed this novel a LOT more than 'He Knew He Was Right', I'd be rating this lower.
Phineas Finn is a young Irishman who has studied the law and has a minor flirtation with the Girl Back Home who he proceeds to never think about for years at a time. He is made the protege of a young noblewoman interested in politics and at an incredibly young age is elected into the House of Commons. He is slightly corrupted, goes to parties, shilly-shallies, and the like. He is a good seat on a horse and handsome enough for the ladies. The plot of the novel surrounds Phineas' coming to terms with what is honorable and what is right in government and must make hard choices for his future. There are subplots involving a duel in Brussels and several potential marriages, but this is a shockingly focused novel. A pity, like I said, I never believed in Phineas' heart. I'll have to see what becomes of him in 'Phineas Redux'.
The Pallisers
Next: 'The Eustace Diamonds'
Previous: 'Can You Forgive Her?'
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