Reviews with content warning for Mental illness - Sorcery of Thorns

I like how much of the early worldbuilding revolves around the grimoires and the propaganda Elisabeth was taught about sorcerers. The way Nathaniel leans into her negative assumptions without actually doing anything to hurt Elisabeth or anyone else means that she learns a lot about the kind of person he is by how he reacts to being misunderstood. It's a wonderful bit of worldbuilding-as-characterization and I love how it works out. He lets her think awful things without trying to defend himself, then when she realizes those assumptions don't match how he's actually behaving it gives her an opportunity to realize she was wrong about him. It's a dynamic that repeats itself throughout the book, gradually receding as they learn to trust each other and communicate more forthrightly. One of my other favorite things in the worldbuilding is how the narration assumes the reader has a starting point in that world, specifically of a person growing up in one of the Great Libraries. Once she leaves, Elisabeth learns some of the outside world's differences in a way that enhances the worldbuilding and teaches about her as a character. If she's startled that the world was one way then it implies that her experience of the Library was different in a specific manner. Immersive worldbuilding is a favorite of mine, and this perfectly fit the kind I like.

Silas is enjoyable as a character whose present form is unassuming but could absolutely fuck someone up if a different version of himself is let loose (Think Mogget from The Old Kingdom books by Garth Nix, but if he liked working).

I thought the first half was just fine (except for the worldbuilding, which was excellent) and then I loved the ending. I didn't enjoy the matrons speculating about Nathaniel's sexuality, and while the resolution of his identity came though his own telling, it felt a bit off.

Nathaniel doesn't want to be treated as a stud for his bloodline (completely understandable) so he turns away hordes of eligible women. Their mothers are upset and speculate that he might be gay (because obviously it must be he doesn't want a woman at all, not that he doesn't want any of their daughters). It made the reveal that he likes men and women feel a bit like Elisabeth is the exception that proves the rule. On the one hand, I'm excited for a bi character getting a m/f relationship because his queerness isn't dependent on his partner's identity. On the other hand, it made it feel like he's bi so that the narrative can tease his dynamic with Silas. There's no jealousy from Elisabeth on their intimacy, which I appreciated, but altogether it left me unable to enjoy Elisabeth and Nathaniel as much as I wanted.

The audiobook performance (particularly for Silas) perfectly fits each character and really enhanced the story. The plot noticeably had distinct stages (not in a bad way). It's a long enough book to have several points of tension and rest, with the danger escalating in a way that felt appropriate to the world and to what the characters had already faced. There were a couple of points in the latter half where things had been so dramatic that I thought maybe it was about to pull a cliffhanger, but the ending is very satisfying and comes at an appropriate point in the pacing.

I enjoyed this and am very excited for a sequel if one materializes. It's listed as a series so I'm hopeful.

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melancholy_rose's review

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adventurous funny mysterious medium-paced

Plot- or character-driven? A mix
Strong character development? Yes
Loveable characters? Yes
Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes

5.0

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oddduck's review

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adventurous mysterious medium-paced

Plot- or character-driven? A mix

3.5

I have Very Mixed Feelings about this book.

To start: I love the premise. The idea of librarians (keepers of knowledge) and sorcerers (users and perhaps finders of knowledge) being at odds with each other is so fascinating. There's so much room for conflict and plot and drama. I also enjoy stories in which characters realize what they've been taught all their lives isn't necessarily the Sole Truth and then have to learn to think for themselves. I vibed with a lot of the basic elements, it was moreso the execution that I did not, but we'll get to that.

Nathaniel and Silas are excellent characters and the BOOKS!!! Love me some sentient books. The books were also so diverse in appearance, personality, and use. Five stars all around for the sentient books. I also adored Nathaniel. He is the only character in this book that made me laugh (numerous times!). He's got just the right mixture of dry humor and resigned "of course this is happening, why wouldn't this be happening?". And he's smart and flawed and kind of dragged into helping Elisabeth by repeated exposure. He's got principles, but he's willing to have his mind changed, and he cares about his people so much. He's clearly still mourning his family, including his father, despite why his father died. And his relationship with Silas. I mean, the end really speaks for itself:

Silas changes his entire nature because Nathaniel cares that deeply for him.

Silas is just a great character though. Quiet, unassuming, prim, and fastidious. He also knows exactly what he is and goes out of his way to make sure Elisabeth knows it too, even if it scares her and means she's less friendly with him. I think that's also why Elisabeth and Nathaniel's insistence that the Silas they know is who he really is works so well. Because they know. Nathaniel has known Silas his whole life and after what happens with his father, he truly understands exactly what Silas is. And he chooses to believe Silas can be something else.

I also got very excited over the casual queer and disability representation. Elisabeth describes Katrien as completely uninteresting in romance (clearly aromantic, or at least aro-spec) and Nathaniel is explicitly bi. Utterly delightful, for both of them. And I loved that it just wasn't a big thing, like at all. Elisabeth literally does not care, beyond confirming that there is a possibility Nathaniel might be into her. And on the disability side of things, Wick and Hyde are so cool. I was thrilled that they were both in positions of significant power, especially Wick, who is visually impaired (which some would argue is an impediment for working in a library). But no! She's the deputy director of the Royal Library! And she uses braille! Excellent. Plus Hyde is explicitly said to be hard of hearing and relies on lip reading. And his hearing is not magically cured when

Ashcroft possesses him. In fact, Ashcroft struggles, because he's not hard of hearing and thus doesn't have the skills Hyde does.

And the ending.

The fact that Nathaniel has lasting damage and a permanent disability from the fight that even magic couldn't fix?

Love it.

In all, I really liked the end of this book. I figured out the plan at a good point. All the seemingly random details were reprised in a satisfying and/or exciting way. All the loose ends were nicely wrapped up. It was a satisfying end, and almost made me rate this higher. But there's just some stuff, especially at the beginning, that I think could have been done better (or not at all).

Elisabeth was not a very strong protagonist for a lot of the book. Especially at the beginning, she felt very reactionary, which is a bit strange since the two big events that kick the whole story off are her deciding to sneak in to see the sorcerer and her deciding to fight the malefict. I think it's because Katrien is the instigator of the first part and, well, if the malefict hadn't already been unleashed, she wouldn't have had to make that decision either. So it's like yeah, she chose to do these things, but it wasn't totally her, which makes her feel a little less autonomous. By the end, she was making decisions and deciding what she wanted, which made me like her a lot more. At the start, I also got some "not like other girls" vibes, which I personally can't stand. Again, the got better as the story progressed, and I did like how practical and down to earth she was, and her unwavering love of books (even as her relationship with her position as a librarian changes) was very endearing, because honestly same.

The romance was okay, but not standout. I adore Nathaniel, as discussed above, and think he's a very solid love interest. I just would have liked to see more bonding moments between Elisabeth and Nathaniel (especially ones that aren't "holy crap we might die"). I love enemies to lovers and while this was more of a one-sided enemies to lovers (because let's be honest, Nathaniel doesn't not consider Elisabeth an enemy the way she does pretty much until the fight with the fiends when they first get to Brassbridge), the development was still satisfactory. Elisabeth gradually learns to trust Nathaniel, and once we reach that point, there's not a whole lot in the way of continued development for their relationship. She's kind of just like "oh I want to kiss him" and then they do that. I don't know. I would have liked more scenes of them just hanging out, maybe taking a break from planning, and talking to each other. That really would have helped the make-out scene before the climax kicks off feel less out of left field for me. (Like seriously, if Silas hadn't interrupted them, would they have actually had sex? Because I'm sorry, they do not know each other well enough for me to believe that's a healthy step for their relationship at this point.)

The sexism/misogyny from the doctor seemed out of place? Well, the whole "Elisabeth is mentally unstable and hysteric" subplot was just weird and gross, really. Like, until this point, there doesn't seem to be that old fashioned sexist attitude in this world. You could make the argument that Warden Finch has it, but I think his feelings more stem from disapproving of raising Elisabeth in the library in the first place and also that she (and later Katrien) keep pranking him and such. He doesn't like her for things she's done, not the fact that she is a girl and/or is doing something he doesn't consider proper for a young woman. Historically, doctors did treat women the way Elisabeth is treated and did in fact claim that novel reading was bad for women, but I argue that this is fantasy. We can just discard oppression with prejudice if we want. And I understand why Ashcroft did this. Discrediting Elisabeth is a smart move. But there were other ways to do it that didn't involve any of this. I strongly disliked this part.

My final main issue is that the plot felt manufactured at times. Like, it was clear that this was something the author had decided was going to happen and thus forced it to work. Again, the end did not feel this way (after the ball) but there were several points before that where it did. The "Elisabeth is mentally unstable and hysteric" subplot is one of these instances, as was the "Elisabeth is obviously innocent because she bravely fought off those fiends, thanks newspapers" bit, the "Elisabeth gets a job at the Royal Library" part and the "let's expose the villain at the ball" decision. Like, I get it. But also it doesn't quite work for me. There's just too many coincidences and they feel too easy. Again, the end comes together really well, but getting there was a little hard for me.

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bluejayreads's review against another edition

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adventurous mysterious slow-paced

Plot- or character-driven? A mix
Strong character development? Yes
Loveable characters? Yes
Diverse cast of characters? No
Flaws of characters a main focus? It's complicated

4.5

After being surprised by how much I enjoyed Vespertine, I added a couple more of Margaret Rogerson’s books to my reading list. I didn’t have high hopes for this one – the back cover made me think there would be way more romance than I enjoy – but as happened last time, I was wrong. This book is very good.

This book covers a lot of similar tropes to Vespertine. Even though there’s no actual church in this book, the Great Library system acts just enough like one to get that “I grew up believing wholeheartedly believing everything the church says but now that I’ve experienced the real world everything’s much more complicated than I thought and maybe this thing they said was evil actually isn’t” vibe. If that isn’t a relatable deconversion mood, I don’t know what is.

Elisabeth is a perfectly serviceable character. She’s not a great force of personality, but she is a great force of will and stubbornness and determination to do the right thing, even if it turns out the right thing is the thing she’s been told is evil her whole life. Her power is in how much she cares about protecting others and doing the right thing. Well, that and sword fighting, a skill that never really gets explained but I guess I can chalk up to library training. (The “power she never guessed” reveal from the back cover is never built up, an anticlimactic reveal, and completely irrelevant to anything, so I’m not factoring that in.)

I was a little concerned about an enemies-to-lovers romance angle popping up. It did happen (I don’t think it’s a spoiler because if you’re at all familiar with YA fantasy you would know it’s coming), but it was a side plot to all the main plot stop-the-people-attacking-the-libraries happenings. Nathaniel also got to be a character in his own right before he became a love interest, and vintage, I’m happy with him as a character and the romance overall.

Also, Nathaniel’s demonic servant almost felt like a color-swapped Sebastian from Black Butler – which was a major bonus for me, since Black Butler is my favorite anime of all time.

As far as plots go, it was pretty straightforward. Elisabeth figures out the culprit pretty early, and most of the story is focused on figuring out the why and how so she and Nathaniel can stop him. The why is a big reveal, but only the “how” would count as a twist. But even without a complex plot, it’s quite enjoyable. There’s mystery elements, a heist, semi-sentient books, plenty of magic, and bloody fights (sword- and otherwise) with demonic creatures. It’s not what I would call action-packed, but there’s plenty of action around other engaging and magical stuff.

Sorcery of Thorns is just a little too straightforward to make my Top Favorites list, but it was a great read. It’s magical enough to hold my interest, the motives of the antagonist are difficult to discover without being frustrating, and it has some relatable feelings about the institution you grew up in being wrong, the complex shades of gray between “right” and “wrong,” and how awesome libraries are. Overall, a very good book.

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martereadsbooks's review

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adventurous dark funny hopeful mysterious sad tense medium-paced

Plot- or character-driven? A mix
Strong character development? Yes
Loveable characters? Yes
Diverse cast of characters? Yes

5.0

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kinskinn's review

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adventurous medium-paced

Plot- or character-driven? A mix
Strong character development? Yes
Loveable characters? It's complicated
Diverse cast of characters? Yes
Flaws of characters a main focus? No

2.0

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dlrosebyh's review

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adventurous mysterious slow-paced

Plot- or character-driven? A mix
Strong character development? Yes
Loveable characters? Yes
Diverse cast of characters? No
Flaws of characters a main focus? No

4.5

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lilifane's review

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adventurous challenging dark emotional funny hopeful lighthearted mysterious fast-paced

Plot- or character-driven? Plot
Strong character development? Yes
Loveable characters? Yes
Diverse cast of characters? Yes
Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes

5.0

I had my doubts about this book. I only knew it takes place in a library and has to do with solving a mystery. Which is kind of correct but then again it's not really what you expect when you hear this.
So I was a little disappointed in the beginning but soon got used to the actualy story and from then on had the time of my life reading it. So let me gush a little bit.
I loooooved the characters and was surprised by the represantation in this book. The main character, Elisabeth, is a tall girl. A really tall girl, bigger than most of the boys/men around her and that was SO cool to read. She's been growing up in a library for magical books and has some mysterious abilities that others don't have. At the beginning of the book she witnesses an attack on her library and tries to uncover the truth behind it. What bothered me the most about her for a long time was how ignorant and prejudiced she is at the beginning, especially for someone living in a library and spending her whole life reading books. I thought that was only a way to give her some room for character development, but in the end it actually made a lot of sense. I also feared this would turn into a damsel in distress situation where Elisabeth had to be rescued all the time, because she tends to get in trouble often... but luckily she is quite capable of rescuing herself thank you very much.
Then there are side characters that are bi, aromantic, disabled (there is a blind librarian and braille is hinted at). Most of this is only mentioned as side notes though, just to show that it's all a regular part of this world. And I liked that.
Another thing I really liked was the fast pace of the story (you can hardly take a breath because one thing happens after another and another and another and another). It's so action packed, so much is happening, but there are also some quiet moments that let you bond with the characters and fall in love with them. My heart was stolen by a demon called Silas, he's the most precious character of all.
I enjoyed the humor, especially Nathaniel's comments towards Elisabeth... which leads to the romance plot that I also enjoyed a lot. It was actually quite refreshing. There was no artificial drama, no miscomunication, no cheesy lovey dovey stuff, just straight forward friendly banter turned into fun flirting with a bit of doom from an approaching apocalypse sprinkled into it.
I loved everything that had to do with the library contents, the investigation, the mystery, but there was a little bit too much fighting for my taste. Soooo many fight scenes. The last quarter of a book feels like one long fight which was a little exhausting.
One last thing I should mention: This book is 100% predictable. If you have a feeling, you know how the story will proceed or how a problem will be resolved, you can be sure that's exactly what will happen. Really no surprises whatsoever. Oh, and you never have the feeling that a situation is hopeless or drags on for too long. There is always a way. And I also enjoyed this a lot, because everything that happens is prepared beforehand and it doesn't feel like information is being withheld just to surprise you or a situation unnecessary prologed just to annoy you.

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