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3.77 AVERAGE
3.77 AVERAGE
challenging
dark
medium-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
Character
Strong character development:
Yes
Loveable characters:
Complicated
Diverse cast of characters:
Yes
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes
adventurous
emotional
mysterious
reflective
tense
slow-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
A mix
Strong character development:
No
Loveable characters:
No
Diverse cast of characters:
Yes
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes
Dune and Dune Messiah have a strange quality of highly enjoyable pretension. They want to be about subtle manoeuvring between the most intelligent people in the galaxy and their deep philosophical reflections. This is impossible, unless you actually are one of those peak human super geniuses, but the way Herbert writes it is still very entertaining. The atmosphere and style fits the goal perfectly, and especially in the first book, the complicated setting and somewhat convoluted plot make an excellent fog between the reader and the text. Confusion about the basic elements of the story distracts the reader from asking "do the things being said here actually make sense?" Now, sometimes they do. But quite a bit of the time they're illusory deepities. And yet, I don't find this a detraction. It's fun. Nobody who could write those scenes would, and nobody else could understand it. I liked Dune enough to read it twice and Messiah was quite good too.
I'm also struck by how un-dated this series is. The fact that it's about a society on a totally different technological track from us, with a totally different social system helps, so the reader isn't struck by vacuum tube computers in the year 4000 or stay at home wives after the total transformation of society. The abhorrence over the use of atomic weapons is slightly cold war-ish, and Baron Harkonnen as evil pederast probably wouldn't fly today, but it's not overpowering. On the whole, these books could've conceivably been written at any time in the past seventy years if I didn't know the actual date.
This book was quite a bit simpler than Dune, since the huge worldbuilding burden is mostly dealt with already, and the plotlines are a bit more tightly interwoven here. It wasn't exactly better, but it went down quite a bit easier than the first book. I probably should've read it much earlier, it's more of a coda to the first book than a story in its own right. Hopefully I won't take 8 years to read the next one. I look forward to seeing what, if any, role Jessica and Irulan will have going forward.
Now for Barlowe's Guide.
I'd really love to ask Barlowe how he justified not using the iconic sandworm and went for the guild steersman instead (which isn't even an extraterrestrial). The steersman is great, and this was one of my favourite pictures in the book when I was a kid, but the reality is a little bit underwhelming compared to the way they were talked about in Dune. The way they were portrayed in the Lynch movie was the best incarnation so far, even if it wasn't faithful to the books. I like the polydactyl hands and feet on Barlowe's design, and the blue skin makes sense as an extreme version of the blue eyes normal humans acquire, but the fish scales are bit too much of a literalisation of some of the descriptions in this book, plus the long face is really goofy.
I'm also struck by how un-dated this series is. The fact that it's about a society on a totally different technological track from us, with a totally different social system helps, so the reader isn't struck by vacuum tube computers in the year 4000 or stay at home wives after the total transformation of society. The abhorrence over the use of atomic weapons is slightly cold war-ish, and Baron Harkonnen as evil pederast probably wouldn't fly today, but it's not overpowering. On the whole, these books could've conceivably been written at any time in the past seventy years if I didn't know the actual date.
This book was quite a bit simpler than Dune, since the huge worldbuilding burden is mostly dealt with already, and the plotlines are a bit more tightly interwoven here. It wasn't exactly better, but it went down quite a bit easier than the first book. I probably should've read it much earlier, it's more of a coda to the first book than a story in its own right. Hopefully I won't take 8 years to read the next one. I look forward to seeing what, if any, role Jessica and Irulan will have going forward.
Now for Barlowe's Guide.
I'd really love to ask Barlowe how he justified not using the iconic sandworm and went for the guild steersman instead (which isn't even an extraterrestrial). The steersman is great, and this was one of my favourite pictures in the book when I was a kid, but the reality is a little bit underwhelming compared to the way they were talked about in Dune. The way they were portrayed in the Lynch movie was the best incarnation so far, even if it wasn't faithful to the books. I like the polydactyl hands and feet on Barlowe's design, and the blue skin makes sense as an extreme version of the blue eyes normal humans acquire, but the fish scales are bit too much of a literalisation of some of the descriptions in this book, plus the long face is really goofy.
SLIGHT SPOILERS
This one was much more scattered than the previous book. In the second book, the story takes a new perspective, focusing much more on Paul's prophetic abilities and the difficulties that come with being emperor, but the dialogue and progression of the story is so wack. Herbert builds up all this tension with the conspirators and how they have some kind of master plan but their shit kinda just falls apart for no reason. Like, this guy really does not know how to write endings. The same thing happens in the first book - it feels like the author just got impatient and decided to skip to the happy ending as fast as he could. The female characters in this book are also extremely upsetting. Paul's wife Chani is basically just a walking womb, and she barely develops at all and then just fucking dies? Alia, Paul's sister, has so many cool powers that could have been explored, but throughout the book she's kind of just Paul's sidekick. You'd think that an author who spent three years writing a book while his wife paid the bills would show a little more appreciation for his female characters, no? I just feel like they could use so much more development. The same can be said with so many other characters. The dialogue in this book is also so shit compared to the previous one. Half the time I don't know wtf they're talking about. Not to mention the fact that Paul is just way too powerful. There really isn't much suspense in this book, because Paul is just going to be Paul.
TLDR: Decent story, interesting politics, but wack dialogue, shitty progression, bad female characters and way too powerful main character. 2/5. I hope the third book will be better.
This one was much more scattered than the previous book. In the second book, the story takes a new perspective, focusing much more on Paul's prophetic abilities and the difficulties that come with being emperor, but the dialogue and progression of the story is so wack. Herbert builds up all this tension with the conspirators and how they have some kind of master plan but their shit kinda just falls apart for no reason. Like, this guy really does not know how to write endings. The same thing happens in the first book - it feels like the author just got impatient and decided to skip to the happy ending as fast as he could. The female characters in this book are also extremely upsetting. Paul's wife Chani is basically just a walking womb, and she barely develops at all and then just fucking dies? Alia, Paul's sister, has so many cool powers that could have been explored, but throughout the book she's kind of just Paul's sidekick. You'd think that an author who spent three years writing a book while his wife paid the bills would show a little more appreciation for his female characters, no? I just feel like they could use so much more development. The same can be said with so many other characters. The dialogue in this book is also so shit compared to the previous one. Half the time I don't know wtf they're talking about. Not to mention the fact that Paul is just way too powerful. There really isn't much suspense in this book, because Paul is just going to be Paul.
TLDR: Decent story, interesting politics, but wack dialogue, shitty progression, bad female characters and way too powerful main character. 2/5. I hope the third book will be better.
adventurous
dark
slow-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
Character
dark
emotional
mysterious
tense
slow-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
Plot
Strong character development:
Complicated
Loveable characters:
Yes
Diverse cast of characters:
Yes
Flaws of characters a main focus:
No
emotional
mysterious
reflective
tense
fast-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
A mix
Strong character development:
Yes
Loveable characters:
Yes
Diverse cast of characters:
Complicated
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes
Initially the change of pace from the first Dune surprised me. This is far more political treachery than planetwide coup, but the introduction of new concepts settled well into a compelling story.
I enjoyed the emotional depth behind fantastical concepts which sometimes lacks in Science Fiction.
I enjoyed the emotional depth behind fantastical concepts which sometimes lacks in Science Fiction.
adventurous
medium-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
A mix
Strong character development:
Yes
Loveable characters:
Complicated
Diverse cast of characters:
No
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes