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missmegreads's review against another edition
2.0
I stuck it out for 100 pages before I called it. I may someday try to go back and finish this, but right now I just can't justify spending another minute of my life slogging through it.
My first issue with this book is that it promises a Chinese (or alt-China) setting and aesthetic, but very little in the book is actually Chinese. Nobody has Chinese names, and in fact nobody has names that are consistent enough to make me think they belong to the same ethnic groups.
The author uses the word "Qin" to describe people ethnically, but not in a way that makes sense. Qin is a thing. It's either a state or it's a dynasty (circa 220 BC), it's a part of Chinese history but it's like the author just picked up the word and mixed it in. I'm not an expert on Chinese history by any means, but I know enough that it bothered me each time I saw it because THAT WORD ACTUALLY MEANS STUFF FROM REAL LIFE HISTORY. So either respect that and address it in a way that makes some sense or USE A DIFFERENT WORD.
The author seems to have nabbed bits and pieces of China that she liked and that was it. It's like she wanted to set a grand epic in, say, generically ye old China but didn't wanna bother doing the massive amount of research it would take to do it well.
The book is in need of some really good editing. The dialogue is terribly awkward in places. The author apparently needs to make up fake exclamatory words: "Aui!" and "Eiya!". Also, the way the author uses the word "cursed" instead of just saying "damn" is grating. I counted it up each time I saw it. Nineteen times in 100 pages, the author could've just used the word "damn".
Take for instance this gem on page 12: "Heya, lads, what say we go down to that thrice-rotted inn and drink what passes for decent rice wine here in this cold-cursed valley?" I winced. That sounds like a bad line out of some snoozefest doorstopper fantasy book set in Medieval Whitebreadia. Shouldn't this guy be helping a farm boy realize his royal destiny or something?
Side note: One thing I've learned is that it's always to the author's benefit not to invent curse words or slang any more than is necessary.
The book also takes a long, long time to get interesting. The first few pages mean very little. Throwing lots of contextless names at us through Kellas's eyes makes them all seem fake and meaningless, which just makes the scene seem pointless.
The entire first chapter is summarized in a paragraph when Kellas speaks to King Anjihosh and frankly, that would've been a better place to start. You know, with the actual story.
Exposition in the book is clumsy. And I mean clumsy. There's literally a scene where all the background info on Anjihosh's reign and general world history is explained by the young princess telling them about her school lessons.
The book does manage to get interesting somewhere around page 40 when people we have context for actually start doing things that we have a reason to care about. And it goes on a good run, following Atani and Dannarah (the king's oldest kids) and Kellas as they discover that King Anjihosh has some seriously awful secrets. There's a runaway prince, a princess who wants to fly on eagles, a guy who was just some reckless fool who climbed a rock and ended up a trusted officer now tasked with looking after this prince who, as I mentioned, doesn't like to stay put.
It gets really good. Like "get the popcorn" good. We're following Kellas, we got some family secrets that just saw the light of day and maybe more waiting to be uncovered, we got a squirrely prince on the loose, a sympathetically tough princess with a crush, and there's some plot actually happening.
Then *bam*. That part of the book ends and we fast forward by forty-four years and suddenly we're right back in a setting filled with characters running around with fake sounding names, a lot of weirdly placed exposition, and no clue as to what kind of actual plot is taking place. All we get are hints that we skipped the good stuff.
Then we get to see Dannarah fly on an eagle and while I'm happy that she gets to be badass, could we maybe get to the point instead of going through a whole new cycle of intro, exposition, description of architecture and background and As You Know Bob type dialogue. It's like having to start again with an entirely new book and given that this thing is 782 pages, I'm just noping my way on out of it.
My first issue with this book is that it promises a Chinese (or alt-China) setting and aesthetic, but very little in the book is actually Chinese. Nobody has Chinese names, and in fact nobody has names that are consistent enough to make me think they belong to the same ethnic groups.
The author uses the word "Qin" to describe people ethnically, but not in a way that makes sense. Qin is a thing. It's either a state or it's a dynasty (circa 220 BC), it's a part of Chinese history but it's like the author just picked up the word and mixed it in. I'm not an expert on Chinese history by any means, but I know enough that it bothered me each time I saw it because THAT WORD ACTUALLY MEANS STUFF FROM REAL LIFE HISTORY. So either respect that and address it in a way that makes some sense or USE A DIFFERENT WORD.
The author seems to have nabbed bits and pieces of China that she liked and that was it. It's like she wanted to set a grand epic in, say, generically ye old China but didn't wanna bother doing the massive amount of research it would take to do it well.
The book is in need of some really good editing. The dialogue is terribly awkward in places. The author apparently needs to make up fake exclamatory words: "Aui!" and "Eiya!". Also, the way the author uses the word "cursed" instead of just saying "damn" is grating. I counted it up each time I saw it. Nineteen times in 100 pages, the author could've just used the word "damn".
Take for instance this gem on page 12: "Heya, lads, what say we go down to that thrice-rotted inn and drink what passes for decent rice wine here in this cold-cursed valley?" I winced. That sounds like a bad line out of some snoozefest doorstopper fantasy book set in Medieval Whitebreadia. Shouldn't this guy be helping a farm boy realize his royal destiny or something?
Side note: One thing I've learned is that it's always to the author's benefit not to invent curse words or slang any more than is necessary.
The book also takes a long, long time to get interesting. The first few pages mean very little. Throwing lots of contextless names at us through Kellas's eyes makes them all seem fake and meaningless, which just makes the scene seem pointless.
The entire first chapter is summarized in a paragraph when Kellas speaks to King Anjihosh and frankly, that would've been a better place to start. You know, with the actual story.
Exposition in the book is clumsy. And I mean clumsy. There's literally a scene where all the background info on Anjihosh's reign and general world history is explained by the young princess telling them about her school lessons.
The book does manage to get interesting somewhere around page 40 when people we have context for actually start doing things that we have a reason to care about. And it goes on a good run, following Atani and Dannarah (the king's oldest kids) and Kellas as they discover that King Anjihosh has some seriously awful secrets. There's a runaway prince, a princess who wants to fly on eagles, a guy who was just some reckless fool who climbed a rock and ended up a trusted officer now tasked with looking after this prince who, as I mentioned, doesn't like to stay put.
It gets really good. Like "get the popcorn" good. We're following Kellas, we got some family secrets that just saw the light of day and maybe more waiting to be uncovered, we got a squirrely prince on the loose, a sympathetically tough princess with a crush, and there's some plot actually happening.
Then *bam*. That part of the book ends and we fast forward by forty-four years and suddenly we're right back in a setting filled with characters running around with fake sounding names, a lot of weirdly placed exposition, and no clue as to what kind of actual plot is taking place. All we get are hints that we skipped the good stuff.
Then we get to see Dannarah fly on an eagle and while I'm happy that she gets to be badass, could we maybe get to the point instead of going through a whole new cycle of intro, exposition, description of architecture and background and As You Know Bob type dialogue. It's like having to start again with an entirely new book and given that this thing is 782 pages, I'm just noping my way on out of it.
cosmoblivion's review against another edition
4.0
I enjoyed the book... as it is classic Kate Elliott. And it was great to return to the world she build in the Spirit Gate series... even some of the characters.
In other ways, the writing became slightly slow for my attention. But this was mostly K.E. setting up details for later events. And she is so good at details.... one cannot miss the visualisation that her descriptions make so clear!
She did 'get me' with her plot twists... because I always look for red herrings and for plot twists. And I even saw these coming but was NOT convinced I had it right... everything could havve gone several different ways.
So, I shall have to find the next books in the series!!!
In other ways, the writing became slightly slow for my attention. But this was mostly K.E. setting up details for later events. And she is so good at details.... one cannot miss the visualisation that her descriptions make so clear!
She did 'get me' with her plot twists... because I always look for red herrings and for plot twists. And I even saw these coming but was NOT convinced I had it right... everything could havve gone several different ways.
So, I shall have to find the next books in the series!!!
katabatic's review against another edition
2.0
Almost DNF'd (did not finish) this one a few times. Solid ending, but it was a tough slog to get to that point. Coulda probably chopped the first 1/3 off and not lost anything of value.
anxiousarachnid's review against another edition
4.0
It took me a little longer than usual to get into the book. However, once I was sucked in I struggled to put it down.
ruineleint's review against another edition
5.0
Let the rating read 4.5
This book came as a surprise. The scope and complexity of the plot were an order of magnitude greater than what I had imagined either from the blurb (which is totally inaccurate) as well as the initial chapters.
Kate Elliott has gotten quite a few things right in this book. She has constructed a very interesting and varied cast of characters, she has built a complex, layered and interesting world, she tells her fascinating story through an intricate and detailed plot - but what surpasses all of these is the way she has presented all of these things to the reader.
There are no clumsy infodumps. On the contrary there is along drawn out, gradual, delicate seeping of information about the characters, history and world - through flashbacks, memories, passing statements, hints - the charm of this process is that the more you read the larger and more complex everything seems and earlier assumptions about the book are called into question. As a diehard fan of Malazan which exemplifies the non-infodump approach, I cannot but admire the delicate intricacy through which Elliott has constructed her narrative.
There are things in there which I should have or came close to disliking. The story is about how a more or less egalitarian society in terms of gender and religion is regressing into an authoritarian and unequal one. Its very sad to read, and sometimes I did wonder if all the political machinations were really necessary where some bladework and blood might have simplified things. Also I am a bit allergic to "woman uses intelligence and non-conventional resources to steer her way in an unequal setting" trope as I believe gender equality gives the characters and their actions greater scope, but the compelling unfolding narrative kept me hooked throughout.
This book is highly recommended.
This book came as a surprise. The scope and complexity of the plot were an order of magnitude greater than what I had imagined either from the blurb (which is totally inaccurate) as well as the initial chapters.
Kate Elliott has gotten quite a few things right in this book. She has constructed a very interesting and varied cast of characters, she has built a complex, layered and interesting world, she tells her fascinating story through an intricate and detailed plot - but what surpasses all of these is the way she has presented all of these things to the reader.
There are no clumsy infodumps. On the contrary there is along drawn out, gradual, delicate seeping of information about the characters, history and world - through flashbacks, memories, passing statements, hints - the charm of this process is that the more you read the larger and more complex everything seems and earlier assumptions about the book are called into question. As a diehard fan of Malazan which exemplifies the non-infodump approach, I cannot but admire the delicate intricacy through which Elliott has constructed her narrative.
There are things in there which I should have or came close to disliking. The story is about how a more or less egalitarian society in terms of gender and religion is regressing into an authoritarian and unequal one. Its very sad to read, and sometimes I did wonder if all the political machinations were really necessary where some bladework and blood might have simplified things. Also I am a bit allergic to "woman uses intelligence and non-conventional resources to steer her way in an unequal setting" trope as I believe gender equality gives the characters and their actions greater scope, but the compelling unfolding narrative kept me hooked throughout.
This book is highly recommended.
simone84's review against another edition
4.0
Found it a bit hard to get into, but great once it got going.
the_discworldian's review against another edition
3.0
A version of this review appeared on my blog, drinkingandink.
Popsugar 2016 Reading Challenge: A book that’s more than 600 pages.
Quick disclaimer: some mild spoilers have probably snuck in below. Read at your own peril.
I don’t read a lot of epic fantasy these days, certainly not as much as I used to, but it all started coming back to me very quickly when I picked up this book. The characters were familiar – in spite of the fact that they were in a world with Asian trappings rather than European (and I fully approve of this move that’s been going on recently to expand fantasy worlds past “vaguely Europe”), I had definitely met them before, in the works of George R.R. Martin, Mercedes Lackey, Raymond Feist, Robert Jordan, etc. There were words that sounded like I’d read them in a Guy Gavriel Kay, another one came back to me from Tad Williams. This was a genre I used to love, and I was willing to stick with this one even after that neat little trick about 90 pages in where, just when I’d started getting used to the characters we had, we jumped 44 years into the future and I had to get used to a whole new crew on a different political landscape. The terms, cultures, and characters were legion, and without an index, map, table of contents, or anything similarly handy, I had a lot of trouble remembering who was who.
Back when I was a kid and very into fantasy (to the despair of my parents), I asked my dad why he didn’t read fantasy. He told me all the made-up terms and names were impossible for him to keep straight. Dad was older than I am now at the time, but damned if I didn’t start feeling the same way reading this book. Who are you? You’re from where? What’s your relationship to which royal household? What’s your name again? Speak up, you young whippersnapper!
About 300 pages in I started questioning whether I really wanted to finish this book. I was feeling angry and I couldn’t quite figure out why. Was it the aforementioned lack of any kind of guide to this world? Was it the godawful expositional dialogue included every three pages? Truly, these characters could not make it ten pages without an exchange something like the following: “Do you remember the time that this thing happened?” “How could I forget? Let me recall it in unnecessary detail so the reader knows our past and what our relationship is like, even though you experienced it with me and presumably already know all of this.” After the first 20 exchanges I found myself longing for the obscurity of a Dorothy Dunnett conversation, where you know the characters have said something to each other but you don’t really know WHAT.
But then I realized what was pissing me off so much, and just like that, I realized I had a mission. I had something to contribute to the lexicon. Remember the Manic Pixie Dream Girl (MPDG)? Remember the Bechdel Test, and Kate Beaton’s Strong Female Characters? Well. Make some room, girls. Allow me to introduce to you the Anne McCaffrey Strong Female Character.
The Anne McCaffrey Strong Female Character (or AMSFC) is based on a type as signature to Anne McCaffrey as the green eyes and freckles she noted as a constant in her biography. The AMSFC is noted for being a woman in charge, a woman with ostensibly some power, who has strong emotions, but whose life is defined by the men around her, and who is usually wrong and needs to be schooled or possibly stabilized by the cooler-headed man. If the man gets emotional and acts on those emotions, by the way, he is usually right. Such were a large percentage of McCaffrey’s heroines. Such is Dannarah, one of the central characters of Black Wolves. And that was what bothered me so much about her: not that she was being treated by such disrespect by the men around her (notably Kellas, who is insufferably smug. I know we’re supposed to like him, but dang. Smug.), but that she was being treated by such disrespect by her own author.
Another familiar type was Sarai, whom I knew I should find sympathetic but I just found trite and a teeeeeny bit problematic. Trite, because if she had come out of the end of this book covered in baby dragons, I wouldn’t have been surprised, ifyouknowwhatimsayin. Problematic, because in spite of her stubbornness in clinging to her faith, her people were the most stereotypical and the narrative seemed to be saying that theirs was kind of a shitty faith and culture. They combined Jewish and Muslim ethnic stereotypes in a way that struck me as icky, and made Sarai kind of a Jessica-from-Merchant-of-Venice when she wasn’t busy being the Khaleesi.
Also, while about halfway through this book, I mentioned to my husband that I would add a full star to my review on Goodreads if there were no rape scenes. Although it wasn’t one I anticipated, I’d like to note that I will not be adding that star. And I’m really, REALLY tired of that being a staple of both epic fantasy and historical fiction.
It wasn’t all bad. At its best moments, the book reminded me that I have a brand-new Guy Gavriel Kay sitting on my bookshelf just waiting for me to read it. I thought the character of Lifka was immensely appealing, and some of the other late-introduced characters, like Fo and her sisters, had promise. Also, as previously mentioned, I FULLY support this move to have fantasy worlds based on other cultures than Generic European. It’s also possible that Epic Fantasy is just not my thing anymore, and if you are into it, you might be into this book.
TL;dr the Anne McCaffrey Strong Female Character. It’s a thing. Use as you choose. Spread the word.
Popsugar 2016 Reading Challenge: A book that’s more than 600 pages.
Quick disclaimer: some mild spoilers have probably snuck in below. Read at your own peril.
I don’t read a lot of epic fantasy these days, certainly not as much as I used to, but it all started coming back to me very quickly when I picked up this book. The characters were familiar – in spite of the fact that they were in a world with Asian trappings rather than European (and I fully approve of this move that’s been going on recently to expand fantasy worlds past “vaguely Europe”), I had definitely met them before, in the works of George R.R. Martin, Mercedes Lackey, Raymond Feist, Robert Jordan, etc. There were words that sounded like I’d read them in a Guy Gavriel Kay, another one came back to me from Tad Williams. This was a genre I used to love, and I was willing to stick with this one even after that neat little trick about 90 pages in where, just when I’d started getting used to the characters we had, we jumped 44 years into the future and I had to get used to a whole new crew on a different political landscape. The terms, cultures, and characters were legion, and without an index, map, table of contents, or anything similarly handy, I had a lot of trouble remembering who was who.
Back when I was a kid and very into fantasy (to the despair of my parents), I asked my dad why he didn’t read fantasy. He told me all the made-up terms and names were impossible for him to keep straight. Dad was older than I am now at the time, but damned if I didn’t start feeling the same way reading this book. Who are you? You’re from where? What’s your relationship to which royal household? What’s your name again? Speak up, you young whippersnapper!
About 300 pages in I started questioning whether I really wanted to finish this book. I was feeling angry and I couldn’t quite figure out why. Was it the aforementioned lack of any kind of guide to this world? Was it the godawful expositional dialogue included every three pages? Truly, these characters could not make it ten pages without an exchange something like the following: “Do you remember the time that this thing happened?” “How could I forget? Let me recall it in unnecessary detail so the reader knows our past and what our relationship is like, even though you experienced it with me and presumably already know all of this.” After the first 20 exchanges I found myself longing for the obscurity of a Dorothy Dunnett conversation, where you know the characters have said something to each other but you don’t really know WHAT.
But then I realized what was pissing me off so much, and just like that, I realized I had a mission. I had something to contribute to the lexicon. Remember the Manic Pixie Dream Girl (MPDG)? Remember the Bechdel Test, and Kate Beaton’s Strong Female Characters? Well. Make some room, girls. Allow me to introduce to you the Anne McCaffrey Strong Female Character.
The Anne McCaffrey Strong Female Character (or AMSFC) is based on a type as signature to Anne McCaffrey as the green eyes and freckles she noted as a constant in her biography. The AMSFC is noted for being a woman in charge, a woman with ostensibly some power, who has strong emotions, but whose life is defined by the men around her, and who is usually wrong and needs to be schooled or possibly stabilized by the cooler-headed man. If the man gets emotional and acts on those emotions, by the way, he is usually right. Such were a large percentage of McCaffrey’s heroines. Such is Dannarah, one of the central characters of Black Wolves. And that was what bothered me so much about her: not that she was being treated by such disrespect by the men around her (notably Kellas, who is insufferably smug. I know we’re supposed to like him, but dang. Smug.), but that she was being treated by such disrespect by her own author.
Another familiar type was Sarai, whom I knew I should find sympathetic but I just found trite and a teeeeeny bit problematic. Trite, because if she had come out of the end of this book covered in baby dragons, I wouldn’t have been surprised, ifyouknowwhatimsayin. Problematic, because in spite of her stubbornness in clinging to her faith, her people were the most stereotypical and the narrative seemed to be saying that theirs was kind of a shitty faith and culture. They combined Jewish and Muslim ethnic stereotypes in a way that struck me as icky, and made Sarai kind of a Jessica-from-Merchant-of-Venice when she wasn’t busy being the Khaleesi.
Also, while about halfway through this book, I mentioned to my husband that I would add a full star to my review on Goodreads if there were no rape scenes. Although it wasn’t one I anticipated, I’d like to note that I will not be adding that star. And I’m really, REALLY tired of that being a staple of both epic fantasy and historical fiction.
It wasn’t all bad. At its best moments, the book reminded me that I have a brand-new Guy Gavriel Kay sitting on my bookshelf just waiting for me to read it. I thought the character of Lifka was immensely appealing, and some of the other late-introduced characters, like Fo and her sisters, had promise. Also, as previously mentioned, I FULLY support this move to have fantasy worlds based on other cultures than Generic European. It’s also possible that Epic Fantasy is just not my thing anymore, and if you are into it, you might be into this book.
TL;dr the Anne McCaffrey Strong Female Character. It’s a thing. Use as you choose. Spread the word.
virginiaduan's review against another edition
5.0
So utterly fantastic. Heartbreaking, as always. The world of The Hundred is fascinating, familiar, and exciting. It is fun to fast forward 50-60 years after what happened in the first trilogy. I'm chafing to find out what happens next. Elliott never stints and her writing is unparalleled.
lottpoet's review against another edition
adventurous
reflective
slow-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? A mix
- Strong character development? Yes
- Loveable characters? No
- Diverse cast of characters? Yes
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
3.0
vailynst's review against another edition
4.0
3.8 Stars
Mix of Audio & Print Review:
This book is hard to review because I have conflicting responses to it. I enjoy stories more in print but hardly have the time for it due to a busy life. Audiobooks have been a great compromise and allow me to continue taking in new stories by ear while I do other things. Richard Ferrone is a good narrator. I would like to listen to him tell another story but he was not the right fit for this one. This story has a solid base on Asian culture. There's a twist of words and pace that needed to be told in a certain fashion. He narration didn't have what my ear needed to hear.
Even when I read the story, that cadence was not consistently placed within the whole of the book. Yet when it was evident, it was a delightful and rich experience.
The story takes place in a made up world but it has too many solid links in phrasing, stories, habits, clothes, objects and etc that link to Asian cultures for me to think of it as a "new world with Asian influences". Because the cultural impacts and mannerisms are so strongly entwined, I felt disgruntled when it was not done well and enthralled when it was.
Overall, the series has a lot of promise and I am a total fan of Kellas. It has an intricate plot, strong characters, rich culture and the rioting flames of battle ready to roar. This book is about a man who had too much spirit to calmly take his place in life and do what others expected of him. His reckless passion tossed him right into the arms of Fate and a fight that he would give his life to champion.
In disjointed scenes going from the present to the past and times between, I stumble into a world that is familiar in every alien way possible. You get a solid base for the world that holds the Hundred, the greedy Empire, dark skinned travelers and common folk. The conflicting details of several people are drawn out in bits and pieces. A glimpse of the preternatural that lives alongside the norm. The whole of a mystery is unveiled as others flit like teasing mist. One formidable hero comes to the last stages of his time as new ones grow to take their own place.
I really like this book a lot but it is not a seamless piece without flaws. I think the next one will be great. I look forward to the next phase of the Hundred and the people who fight for their vision of it.
Mix of Audio & Print Review:
This book is hard to review because I have conflicting responses to it. I enjoy stories more in print but hardly have the time for it due to a busy life. Audiobooks have been a great compromise and allow me to continue taking in new stories by ear while I do other things. Richard Ferrone is a good narrator. I would like to listen to him tell another story but he was not the right fit for this one. This story has a solid base on Asian culture. There's a twist of words and pace that needed to be told in a certain fashion. He narration didn't have what my ear needed to hear.
Even when I read the story, that cadence was not consistently placed within the whole of the book. Yet when it was evident, it was a delightful and rich experience.
The story takes place in a made up world but it has too many solid links in phrasing, stories, habits, clothes, objects and etc that link to Asian cultures for me to think of it as a "new world with Asian influences". Because the cultural impacts and mannerisms are so strongly entwined, I felt disgruntled when it was not done well and enthralled when it was.
Overall, the series has a lot of promise and I am a total fan of Kellas. It has an intricate plot, strong characters, rich culture and the rioting flames of battle ready to roar. This book is about a man who had too much spirit to calmly take his place in life and do what others expected of him. His reckless passion tossed him right into the arms of Fate and a fight that he would give his life to champion.
In disjointed scenes going from the present to the past and times between, I stumble into a world that is familiar in every alien way possible. You get a solid base for the world that holds the Hundred, the greedy Empire, dark skinned travelers and common folk. The conflicting details of several people are drawn out in bits and pieces. A glimpse of the preternatural that lives alongside the norm. The whole of a mystery is unveiled as others flit like teasing mist. One formidable hero comes to the last stages of his time as new ones grow to take their own place.
I really like this book a lot but it is not a seamless piece without flaws. I think the next one will be great. I look forward to the next phase of the Hundred and the people who fight for their vision of it.