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Quite probably not in the right mindset to read this.
Liked Helen quite a bit. Also Achilles and Patroclus were hella gaaaaay.
Liked Helen quite a bit. Also Achilles and Patroclus were hella gaaaaay.
adventurous
challenging
dark
funny
slow-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
A mix
Strong character development:
Complicated
Loveable characters:
Complicated
Diverse cast of characters:
No
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes
adventurous
funny
medium-paced
adventurous
challenging
dark
medium-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
Character
Strong character development:
No
Loveable characters:
Complicated
Diverse cast of characters:
No
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes
I think it holds up surprisingly well. Originally, I read the versions translated from Greek to Latin (not the - much shorter - Illias Latina). Some Greek to Latin translations came out a bit weird, which was compounded by my own struggle to translate Latin to English.
The main difference between my Greek to Latin to English reading and the Greek to English version seems to be how friendly Achilles was with his best friend and cousin.
The main difference between my Greek to Latin to English reading and the Greek to English version seems to be how friendly Achilles was with his best friend and cousin.
adventurous
dark
slow-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
A mix
Strong character development:
Complicated
Loveable characters:
No
Diverse cast of characters:
N/A
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes
Reread before I jump into the new translation by [a:Emily Wilson|478455|Emily Wilson|https://images.gr-assets.com/authors/1677271445p2/478455.jpg], to prepare for my upcoming novel about the messenger goddess, Iris.
Robert Fagles' translation of the ancient Greek poem about war, ‘The Iliad.’ is said to be the best one for beauty and clarity, and I found that was true. Fagle’s poem is very accessible and it makes clear what may be fuzzy for modern ordinary readers in trying to understand the culture, literature and emotions of a very ancient people who inadvertently passed down a story from millennia ago. Since the poem was written originally in another language, although the pain, hopes, losses and triumphs of war are unchanging, transforming Greek word meanings into English grammatical constructions can make or break an English reader’s interest and/or comprehension.
The first stanzas of Fagles' translation of Book One:
Rage—Goddess, sing the rage of Peleus’ son Achilles,
murderous, doomed, that cost the Achaeans countless losses,
hurling down to the House of Death so many sturdy souls,
great fighters’ souls, but made their bodies carrion,
feasts for the dogs and birds,
and the will of Zeus was moving toward its end.
Begin, Muse, when the two first broke and clashed,
Agamemnon lord of men and brilliant Achilles.
Homer (1991-07-01). The Iliad (Penguin Classics) (p. 77). Penguin Group US. Kindle Edition.
This is Richard Lattimore’s translation of the same stanzas:
Sing, goddess, the anger of Peleus’ son Achilleus
and its devastation, which put pains thousandfold upon the Achaians, hurled in their multitudes to the house of Hades strong souls
of heroes, but gave their bodies to be the delicate feasting
of dogs, of all birds, and the will of Zeus was accomplished
since that time when first there stood in division of conflict
Atreus’ son the lord of men and brilliant Achilleus.
Homer (2011-09-19). The Iliad of Homer (p. 75). University of Chicago Press. Kindle Edition.
This is Alexander Pope’s translation:
Achilles' wrath, to Greece the direful spring
Of woes unnumber'd, heavenly goddess, sing!
That wrath which hurl'd to Pluto's gloomy reign
The souls of mighty chiefs untimely slain;
Whose limbs unburied on the naked shore,
Devouring dogs and hungry vultures tore.
Since great Achilles and Atrides strove,
Such was the sovereign doom, and such the will of Jove!
HOMER (2013-09-23). THE ILIAD and THE ODYSSEY (complete, unabridged, and in verse) (Kindle Locations 901-905). Classic Homer: Iliad and Odyssey. Kindle Edition.
All three of the above examples are from books which also include copious notes and explanations from famous scholars who admire the poets to whose work they are helpfully adding their critiques and understanding, so it comes down to what the reader finds most pleasing or what version the student is asked to read by a course instructor. Fagle’s work has an introduction written by Bernard Knox, who is a famous Iliad scholar and translator as well.
However, for those of you whining about how boring or incomprehensible this entire 700-page of a monster book is, and if it wasn’t that you needed to read it for a class or for the kudos of having read it, keep in mind the first time I (as well as others as old as me) read about the Achaens’ ten-year war with the City of Troy, there was no Internet or digital book providers. You can ‘google’ (or ‘bing’) everything there is possible to know about the ancient Greeks, the Trojans, their myths, and the latest discoveries by archeologists uncovering what they believe is the actual, real city of Troy! IMO, this is a WAY more fun time to be reading ‘The Iliad’, especially if the reader takes it slow and looks at the various translations to find the one which best suits.
That said, my eyes glazed over after the dozens and dozens of passages similar to the below excerpt, reciting hundreds and hundreds of names and genealogies:
“And Thoas son of Andraemon led Aetolia’s units, soldiers who lived in Pleuron, Pylene and Olenus, Chalcis along the shore and Calydon’s rocky heights where the sons of wellborn Oeneus were no more and the king himself was dead and Meleager with his golden hair was gone. So the rule of all Aetolian men had passed to Thoas…”
Homer (1991-07-01). The Iliad (Penguin Classics) (p. 120). Penguin Group US. Kindle Edition.
I must admit, gentle reader, I did skim these sections, although sadly, because I know those original story tellers who made the monumental effort of passing down this poem did so entirely on a verbal, not written, basis, having memorized all of these names along with the entire poem! Bravo, you ancients!
One other major issue that people, especially sensitive people, have difficulty with in reading ‘The Iliad’ is the explicit gothic horrors of war that seem to make up at least two-thirds of the poem. According to experts, the slicing, cutting and stabbing wounds vividly described for thousands of lines are actually true-to-life. Despite the fact this war is fought with swords, knives, spears, arrows, chariots and other heavy and sharp bronze-age gear, it is obvious that brains and guts are as easy to get at with yesteryear’s cutting and stabbing instruments as well as by using bullets today.
“Agamemnon never saw him—
tensed with a spear
and slashed him under the elbow, down the forearm—
a glint of metal—
the point ripped through his flesh
and the lord of fighting men Atrides shuddered.
Not that he quit the foray even then—
he sprang at Coon, gripping his big spearshaft
tough from the gusting wind that whipped its tree.
Coon was just dragging his brother footfirst,
wild now to retrieve his own father’s son,
calling for help from all the bravest men—
but as Coon hauled the body through the press
Agamemnon lunged up, under his bossed shield,
thrust home hard with the polished bronze point,
unstrung his limbs and reared and lopped his head
and the head tumbled onto his fallen brother’s corpse.
So then and there under royal Agamemnon’s hands
the two sons of Antenor filled out their fates
and down they plunged to the strong House of Death.”
Homer (1991-07-01). The Iliad (Penguin Classics) (pp. 304-305). Penguin Group US. Kindle Edition.
“Odysseus caught him up under the bulging shield with a jabbing spear that split him crotch to navel— the man writhed in the dust, hands clutching the earth. Odysseus left them dead and skewered Hippasus’ son…”
Homer (1991-07-01). The Iliad (Penguin Classics) (p. 310). Penguin Group US. Kindle Edition.
“Both fighters at one great stroke chopped at each other— Pisander hacked the horn of the horsehair-crested helmet right at its ridge, lunging as Menelaus hacked Pisander between the eyes, the bridge of the nose, and bone cracked, blood sprayed and both eyes dropped at his feet to mix in the dust— he curled and crashed. Digging a heel in his chest Menelaus stripped his gear and vaunted out in glory…”
Homer (1991-07-01). The Iliad (Penguin Classics) (p. 361). Penguin Group US. Kindle Edition.
For the realism-minded reader, they might wince at the inclusion of old Greek gods and goddesses choosing which side they want to support, and the ensuing chaos created when the immortals fly down to earth whisking away their favorite warriors to safety, or setting up an opposing fighter for their favorite to kill. Zeus is not pleased, and spends some time, and verses, punishing and threatening his family of gods, to their chagrin. I thought their frequent commentary and obstructive behaviors very amusing, and to be frank, a welcome diversion from the very literal rivers of blood and body parts caking the boots of the fighters.
So, why is this book on everyone’s ‘must read’ list?
The pathos and pity of war is frequently on display, as heartbreaking to the Achaens and Trojans as it is to us; the tearful soliloquies of friends, elderly parents, widows and children left to survive alone without their loved ones eloquent in their losses:
“Oh Hector! Don’t just stand there, don’t, dear child,
waiting that man’s attack— alone, cut off from friends!
You’ll meet your doom at once, beaten down by Achilles,
so much stronger than you— that hard, headlong man.
Oh if only the gods loved him as much as I do ...
dogs and vultures would eat his fallen corpse at once!—
with what a load of misery lifted from my spirit.
That man who robbed me of many sons, brave boys,
cutting them down or selling them off as slaves,
shipped to islands half the world away ...
Even now there are two, Lycaon and Potydorus—
I cannot find them among the soldiers crowding Troy,
those sons Laothoe bore me, Laothoë queen of women.
But if they are still alive in the enemy’s camp,
then we’ll ransom them back with bronze and gold.
We have hoards inside the walls, the rich dowry
old and famous Altes presented with his daughter.
But if they’re dead already, gone to the House of Death,
what grief to their mother’s heart and mine— we gave
them life.
For the rest of Troy, though, just a moment’s grief
unless you too are battered down by Achilles.
Back, come back! Inside the walls, my boy!
Rescue the men of Troy and the Trojan women—
don’t hand the great glory to Peleus’ son,
bereft of your own sweet life yourself.
Pity me too!—
still in my senses, true, but a harrowed, broken man
marked out by doom— past the threshold of old age ...
and Father Zeus will waste me with a hideous fate,
and after I’ve lived to look on so much horror!
My sons laid low, my daughters dragged away
Homer (1991-07-01). The Iliad (Penguin Classics) (pp. 542-543). Penguin Group US. Kindle Edition.
At the same time I was reading ‘The Iliad’ for a bookclub read, I was also reading, [b:A Clash of Kings|10572|A Clash of Kings (A Song of Ice and Fire, #2)|George R.R. Martin|https://i.gr-assets.com/images/S/compressed.photo.goodreads.com/books/1567840212l/10572._SY75_.jpg|3272005], book two in the ‘A Song of Ice and Fire’ series. I did not know what to expect from the Martin book when I started it, but it turned out to be an interesting complementary read to Homer’s myths of warfare, gods and the emotional pain of loss. The similarities between the two are so many, I wonder at George Martin’s inspiration.
I truly hope this classic read (meaning ‘The Iliad’, although ‘A Clash of Kings’ is good, too) is on everyone’s TBR list.
The first stanzas of Fagles' translation of Book One:
Rage—Goddess, sing the rage of Peleus’ son Achilles,
murderous, doomed, that cost the Achaeans countless losses,
hurling down to the House of Death so many sturdy souls,
great fighters’ souls, but made their bodies carrion,
feasts for the dogs and birds,
and the will of Zeus was moving toward its end.
Begin, Muse, when the two first broke and clashed,
Agamemnon lord of men and brilliant Achilles.
Homer (1991-07-01). The Iliad (Penguin Classics) (p. 77). Penguin Group US. Kindle Edition.
This is Richard Lattimore’s translation of the same stanzas:
Sing, goddess, the anger of Peleus’ son Achilleus
and its devastation, which put pains thousandfold upon the Achaians, hurled in their multitudes to the house of Hades strong souls
of heroes, but gave their bodies to be the delicate feasting
of dogs, of all birds, and the will of Zeus was accomplished
since that time when first there stood in division of conflict
Atreus’ son the lord of men and brilliant Achilleus.
Homer (2011-09-19). The Iliad of Homer (p. 75). University of Chicago Press. Kindle Edition.
This is Alexander Pope’s translation:
Achilles' wrath, to Greece the direful spring
Of woes unnumber'd, heavenly goddess, sing!
That wrath which hurl'd to Pluto's gloomy reign
The souls of mighty chiefs untimely slain;
Whose limbs unburied on the naked shore,
Devouring dogs and hungry vultures tore.
Since great Achilles and Atrides strove,
Such was the sovereign doom, and such the will of Jove!
HOMER (2013-09-23). THE ILIAD and THE ODYSSEY (complete, unabridged, and in verse) (Kindle Locations 901-905). Classic Homer: Iliad and Odyssey. Kindle Edition.
All three of the above examples are from books which also include copious notes and explanations from famous scholars who admire the poets to whose work they are helpfully adding their critiques and understanding, so it comes down to what the reader finds most pleasing or what version the student is asked to read by a course instructor. Fagle’s work has an introduction written by Bernard Knox, who is a famous Iliad scholar and translator as well.
However, for those of you whining about how boring or incomprehensible this entire 700-page of a monster book is, and if it wasn’t that you needed to read it for a class or for the kudos of having read it, keep in mind the first time I (as well as others as old as me) read about the Achaens’ ten-year war with the City of Troy, there was no Internet or digital book providers. You can ‘google’ (or ‘bing’) everything there is possible to know about the ancient Greeks, the Trojans, their myths, and the latest discoveries by archeologists uncovering what they believe is the actual, real city of Troy! IMO, this is a WAY more fun time to be reading ‘The Iliad’, especially if the reader takes it slow and looks at the various translations to find the one which best suits.
That said, my eyes glazed over after the dozens and dozens of passages similar to the below excerpt, reciting hundreds and hundreds of names and genealogies:
“And Thoas son of Andraemon led Aetolia’s units, soldiers who lived in Pleuron, Pylene and Olenus, Chalcis along the shore and Calydon’s rocky heights where the sons of wellborn Oeneus were no more and the king himself was dead and Meleager with his golden hair was gone. So the rule of all Aetolian men had passed to Thoas…”
Homer (1991-07-01). The Iliad (Penguin Classics) (p. 120). Penguin Group US. Kindle Edition.
I must admit, gentle reader, I did skim these sections, although sadly, because I know those original story tellers who made the monumental effort of passing down this poem did so entirely on a verbal, not written, basis, having memorized all of these names along with the entire poem! Bravo, you ancients!
One other major issue that people, especially sensitive people, have difficulty with in reading ‘The Iliad’ is the explicit gothic horrors of war that seem to make up at least two-thirds of the poem. According to experts, the slicing, cutting and stabbing wounds vividly described for thousands of lines are actually true-to-life. Despite the fact this war is fought with swords, knives, spears, arrows, chariots and other heavy and sharp bronze-age gear, it is obvious that brains and guts are as easy to get at with yesteryear’s cutting and stabbing instruments as well as by using bullets today.
“Agamemnon never saw him—
tensed with a spear
and slashed him under the elbow, down the forearm—
a glint of metal—
the point ripped through his flesh
and the lord of fighting men Atrides shuddered.
Not that he quit the foray even then—
he sprang at Coon, gripping his big spearshaft
tough from the gusting wind that whipped its tree.
Coon was just dragging his brother footfirst,
wild now to retrieve his own father’s son,
calling for help from all the bravest men—
but as Coon hauled the body through the press
Agamemnon lunged up, under his bossed shield,
thrust home hard with the polished bronze point,
unstrung his limbs and reared and lopped his head
and the head tumbled onto his fallen brother’s corpse.
So then and there under royal Agamemnon’s hands
the two sons of Antenor filled out their fates
and down they plunged to the strong House of Death.”
Homer (1991-07-01). The Iliad (Penguin Classics) (pp. 304-305). Penguin Group US. Kindle Edition.
“Odysseus caught him up under the bulging shield with a jabbing spear that split him crotch to navel— the man writhed in the dust, hands clutching the earth. Odysseus left them dead and skewered Hippasus’ son…”
Homer (1991-07-01). The Iliad (Penguin Classics) (p. 310). Penguin Group US. Kindle Edition.
“Both fighters at one great stroke chopped at each other— Pisander hacked the horn of the horsehair-crested helmet right at its ridge, lunging as Menelaus hacked Pisander between the eyes, the bridge of the nose, and bone cracked, blood sprayed and both eyes dropped at his feet to mix in the dust— he curled and crashed. Digging a heel in his chest Menelaus stripped his gear and vaunted out in glory…”
Homer (1991-07-01). The Iliad (Penguin Classics) (p. 361). Penguin Group US. Kindle Edition.
For the realism-minded reader, they might wince at the inclusion of old Greek gods and goddesses choosing which side they want to support, and the ensuing chaos created when the immortals fly down to earth whisking away their favorite warriors to safety, or setting up an opposing fighter for their favorite to kill. Zeus is not pleased, and spends some time, and verses, punishing and threatening his family of gods, to their chagrin. I thought their frequent commentary and obstructive behaviors very amusing, and to be frank, a welcome diversion from the very literal rivers of blood and body parts caking the boots of the fighters.
So, why is this book on everyone’s ‘must read’ list?
The pathos and pity of war is frequently on display, as heartbreaking to the Achaens and Trojans as it is to us; the tearful soliloquies of friends, elderly parents, widows and children left to survive alone without their loved ones eloquent in their losses:
“Oh Hector! Don’t just stand there, don’t, dear child,
waiting that man’s attack— alone, cut off from friends!
You’ll meet your doom at once, beaten down by Achilles,
so much stronger than you— that hard, headlong man.
Oh if only the gods loved him as much as I do ...
dogs and vultures would eat his fallen corpse at once!—
with what a load of misery lifted from my spirit.
That man who robbed me of many sons, brave boys,
cutting them down or selling them off as slaves,
shipped to islands half the world away ...
Even now there are two, Lycaon and Potydorus—
I cannot find them among the soldiers crowding Troy,
those sons Laothoe bore me, Laothoë queen of women.
But if they are still alive in the enemy’s camp,
then we’ll ransom them back with bronze and gold.
We have hoards inside the walls, the rich dowry
old and famous Altes presented with his daughter.
But if they’re dead already, gone to the House of Death,
what grief to their mother’s heart and mine— we gave
them life.
For the rest of Troy, though, just a moment’s grief
unless you too are battered down by Achilles.
Back, come back! Inside the walls, my boy!
Rescue the men of Troy and the Trojan women—
don’t hand the great glory to Peleus’ son,
bereft of your own sweet life yourself.
Pity me too!—
still in my senses, true, but a harrowed, broken man
marked out by doom— past the threshold of old age ...
and Father Zeus will waste me with a hideous fate,
and after I’ve lived to look on so much horror!
My sons laid low, my daughters dragged away
Homer (1991-07-01). The Iliad (Penguin Classics) (pp. 542-543). Penguin Group US. Kindle Edition.
At the same time I was reading ‘The Iliad’ for a bookclub read, I was also reading, [b:A Clash of Kings|10572|A Clash of Kings (A Song of Ice and Fire, #2)|George R.R. Martin|https://i.gr-assets.com/images/S/compressed.photo.goodreads.com/books/1567840212l/10572._SY75_.jpg|3272005], book two in the ‘A Song of Ice and Fire’ series. I did not know what to expect from the Martin book when I started it, but it turned out to be an interesting complementary read to Homer’s myths of warfare, gods and the emotional pain of loss. The similarities between the two are so many, I wonder at George Martin’s inspiration.
I truly hope this classic read (meaning ‘The Iliad’, although ‘A Clash of Kings’ is good, too) is on everyone’s TBR list.
Robert Fagles's translation of the Iliad is my personal favorite; it's the one that's on my actual bookshelf at home, the one I use any time I need to cite the Iliad for research papers, and the one that I buy and give to anybody who has to read it for the first time.
adventurous
dark
slow-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
Plot
Strong character development:
Complicated
Loveable characters:
Yes
Diverse cast of characters:
No
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Complicated
adventurous
challenging
emotional
informative
sad
tense
slow-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
A mix
Strong character development:
No
Loveable characters:
Yes
Diverse cast of characters:
No
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes
I love it so dearly, it is such a beautiful tale of human connection, how violence leads to violence, and the casualties of war.