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jo2424's review
reflective
fast-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Character
- Strong character development? No
- Loveable characters? No
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
3.0
Content Warnings
Graphic: Sexual harassment
Minor: Child abuse
aoib's review
reflective
fast-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Character
- Strong character development? No
- Loveable characters? It's complicated
- Diverse cast of characters? No
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
3.0
This book isn't my cup of tea.
The writing is wonderful, so it is clear how talented the author is. However, the theme of the story is… really an acquired taste. I generally try to remain open to characters with different views than mine and controversial subjects, especially when they are handled with such good writing and pacing, but at times this book felt just like a rant from a conservative politician or a Twitter incel.
The characters are completely terrible people, with troubling opinions about public conduct and what constitutes harassment. That some of this opinion comes from a woman is even more worrying.
There is a moment in which the main female character compares women to horses and another in which Quin - the definition of a nice man in a main character -, faced with a sexual harassment lawsuit, defines his conduct as an expression of the 'values of freedom and honesty about politeness'. This is just laughable.
'This is pleasure' is the first book I've read by the author, so I really can't say if it's her own opinion or if it's a situation similar to Lolita, in which we have to question the characters and what they represent.
Well, I reiterate what I mentioned above: this story isn't my cup of tea, but it's still a well-written book.
The writing is wonderful, so it is clear how talented the author is. However, the theme of the story is… really an acquired taste. I generally try to remain open to characters with different views than mine and controversial subjects, especially when they are handled with such good writing and pacing, but at times this book felt just like a rant from a conservative politician or a Twitter incel.
The characters are completely terrible people, with troubling opinions about public conduct and what constitutes harassment. That some of this opinion comes from a woman is even more worrying.
There is a moment in which the main female character compares women to horses and another in which Quin - the definition of a nice man in a main character -, faced with a sexual harassment lawsuit, defines his conduct as an expression of the 'values of freedom and honesty about politeness'. This is just laughable.
'This is pleasure' is the first book I've read by the author, so I really can't say if it's her own opinion or if it's a situation similar to Lolita, in which we have to question the characters and what they represent.
Well, I reiterate what I mentioned above: this story isn't my cup of tea, but it's still a well-written book.
Content Warnings
Graphic: Sexual harassment and Sexual assault
Moderate: Sexual content
Minor: Child abuse
anafuentes's review against another edition
challenging
dark
reflective
fast-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Character
- Strong character development? No
- Loveable characters? No
- Diverse cast of characters? No
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
4.0
This is Pleasure by Mary Gaitskill tells the story of the friendship between Margot and Quin after Quin is accused of sexual misconduct by several women. Many of the women coming forward Quin has worked with throughout decades at a publishing house where he held a position of power over them. Quin fails to understand what he did wrong, while Margot struggles to understand how to feel while she vacillates between anger at Quin’s actions and the deep admiration she had long held for her friend.
For a short story, it really does pack a punch. The prose was enthralling and while the characters may be frustrating, it’s a hard story to put down regardless. What most draws me in is the conviction Quin holds that he’s blameless. He has undoubtedly hurt and coerced women, but he is certain everything will work out for him in the end. I parallel this to the many sexual harassment/assault claims that have come out over the years and how often times, there is a denial of these things occurring by the blamed party initially. I also think about how difficult it is to convict in these cases when they do happen. Disappointingly, Quin’s mentality around this seems to fit the norm, but it’s jarring being in the mind of someone like this. Meanwhile, Margot does not want to think any differently of her friend but she can also clearly see the behavior his accusers were pointing out, as she recalls similar moments occurring with her. She believes she stood up to him and that he has respected her ever since. Actually, Quin’s manipulation tactics were used on Margot as well, although after one of their first meetings they were less overtly sexual, and this seems to be why she’s still attached to him like some of the women in his life still are and how some of his accusers may have felt at some point.
The story doesn’t wrap up neatly and we don’t know what will occur, but being inside the psyche of these characters while they work through this situation was curious. Alongside them, we sort through the manipulations and self-delusions the characters have come to believe.
Content Warnings
Graphic: Sexual harassment
Minor: Child abuse
mold_munchr's review
challenging
dark
emotional
fast-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Character
- Strong character development? No
- Loveable characters? No
- Diverse cast of characters? No
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
4.0
disgusting and I never want to read it again. and yet, I'm so glad I picked this book up
Content Warnings
Graphic: Misogyny, Sexism, Body shaming, Fatphobia, Sexual assault, Sexual harassment, Sexual violence, Toxic friendship, and Gaslighting
Moderate: Child abuse
Minor: Suicide
laurenboisset's review
challenging
dark
fast-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Character
- Strong character development? No
- Loveable characters? No
- Diverse cast of characters? No
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
4.0
Bleh.
A phenomenally written exploration of two thoroughly human and truly heinous people. There are few characters who have made me as sick to my stomach as Quin, because his brand of playful, 'free-spirited,' aggressive misogyny is something I and many other women have and will continue to encounter in real life.
The one thing that takes off a star for me is that I can't 100% parse Gaitskill's intentions with his character, even with having read numerous interviews by her. I understand Death of the Author and all that - unfortunately having read my fair share of Barthes during my degree - but with a subject such as this, I'm going to be interested in what they have to say.
I'm probably going to come back to this later to figure out my opinion, so watch this space.
A phenomenally written exploration of two thoroughly human and truly heinous people. There are few characters who have made me as sick to my stomach as Quin, because his brand of playful, 'free-spirited,' aggressive misogyny is something I and many other women have and will continue to encounter in real life.
The one thing that takes off a star for me is that I can't 100% parse Gaitskill's intentions with his character, even with having read numerous interviews by her. I understand Death of the Author and all that - unfortunately having read my fair share of Barthes during my degree - but with a subject such as this, I'm going to be interested in what they have to say.
I'm probably going to come back to this later to figure out my opinion, so watch this space.
Content Warnings
Graphic: Sexual harassment
Moderate: Child abuse and Sexual assault
majo_hun's review against another edition
fast-paced
3.0
About a man who shows a lack of respect to women and is suprised by them not liking it.
Content Warnings
Minor: Child abuse and Sexual assault
librarymouse's review
challenging
emotional
funny
reflective
fast-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Character
- Strong character development? It's complicated
- Loveable characters? It's complicated
- Diverse cast of characters? No
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
4.25
This is Pleasure is very well written with a compelling narrative that switches between perspectives and with easily consumable sentence length and structure.
This is Pleasure gives an interesting perspective on sexual harassment in the workplace, and the idea that people can be grandfathered into respectability because they came from a different time. Quinn's lack of understanding of how his actions impact those around him doesn't show malice, exactly, but instead how he views himself to be a good person. He knows that he's different from the younger generation who are more attuned to the fact that women are people, but he doesn't understand the idea that he is in a position of power. Margo being from a similar generation and having the foundation of their relationships be her turning him down makes their relationship quite complicated in the face of the allegations against Quinn because she believes that if she was able to turn him down why weren't the other young women able to do the same. There is a lot of internalized misogyny in these characters. Aside from referencing the accusers as being like Shakespearean witches and calling one of them "a little bitch", Quinn views the women he interacts with as players in the game that is his life. He asked them on to play with him in the intimate and sometimes uncomfortably sexual space he creates in conversation. He's gregarious and powerful in his field, and he draws people in while simultaneously disgusting them. Margo's oscillation between anger at and love for Quinn makes her character particularly interesting to view through the lens of her interactions with other women. She decided that Quinn was better than her female friends because one of them didn't help her in a time of need. At the same time, she disregards the needs, fears, and heartache that plague Quinn's wife and daughter because of his "flirtations" and later the accusations against him. She admits to letting them fade into the background of her relationship with Quinn. For such a short read, this book was very interesting. Most of my friendships exist outside of this space, but every so often at work I'll have an interaction where an older man references me as doll or pretty, and asks me to bag up his book for him because "women always do it better", or one who always asks for help finding a specific variety of books in a specific section because he knows it means I'll have to kneel in front of him to get them. I'm glad to not have people like Quin as intimate friends, but I'm also glad to have read this to get a glimpse into their psyche.
This is Pleasure gives an interesting perspective on sexual harassment in the workplace, and the idea that people can be grandfathered into respectability because they came from a different time. Quinn's lack of understanding of how his actions impact those around him doesn't show malice, exactly, but instead how he views himself to be a good person. He knows that he's different from the younger generation who are more attuned to the fact that women are people, but he doesn't understand the idea that he is in a position of power. Margo being from a similar generation and having the foundation of their relationships be her turning him down makes their relationship quite complicated in the face of the allegations against Quinn because she believes that if she was able to turn him down why weren't the other young women able to do the same. There is a lot of internalized misogyny in these characters. Aside from referencing the accusers as being like Shakespearean witches and calling one of them "a little bitch", Quinn views the women he interacts with as players in the game that is his life. He asked them on to play with him in the intimate and sometimes uncomfortably sexual space he creates in conversation. He's gregarious and powerful in his field, and he draws people in while simultaneously disgusting them. Margo's oscillation between anger at and love for Quinn makes her character particularly interesting to view through the lens of her interactions with other women. She decided that Quinn was better than her female friends because one of them didn't help her in a time of need. At the same time, she disregards the needs, fears, and heartache that plague Quinn's wife and daughter because of his "flirtations" and later the accusations against him. She admits to letting them fade into the background of her relationship with Quinn. For such a short read, this book was very interesting. Most of my friendships exist outside of this space, but every so often at work I'll have an interaction where an older man references me as doll or pretty, and asks me to bag up his book for him because "women always do it better", or one who always asks for help finding a specific variety of books in a specific section because he knows it means I'll have to kneel in front of him to get them. I'm glad to not have people like Quin as intimate friends, but I'm also glad to have read this to get a glimpse into their psyche.
Content Warnings
Moderate: Sexism, Sexual harassment, Toxic friendship, Toxic relationship, Sexual assault, Sexual content, and Sexual violence
Minor: Child abuse
adelineania's review against another edition
challenging
reflective
fast-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Character
- Strong character development? No
- Loveable characters? No
- Diverse cast of characters? No
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
4.0
Content Warnings
Graphic: Sexual harassment
Minor: Child abuse
parisa0npluto's review
challenging
dark
fast-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Character
- Strong character development? No
- Loveable characters? It's complicated
- Diverse cast of characters? Yes
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
3.0
i only enjoyed this book because i believe that all art is intentional. i don't think mary gatskill is idealizing these characters, if she was this book wouldn't get the rating it has from me.
men really don't know what to do with the power society gives them over women. they're supposed to 'take the lead', but also not ask for consent. it's all fucked.the metaphor about the man on his knees begging and barking for a kiss was surprisingly well done. sexual assault/abuse is a systematic issue and giving it a human face helps us get a step or two closer to realizing that, quin was kind and funny and weird, and everyone thought the "weirdness" was just a part of him. they accepted him. everything the author did with his character was so intentional. he did weirdly kind stuff for people he barely knew, but he also didn't respect their boundaries. i also love that margot called her friend's accusers 'little bitches' and then when he in turn, made comments about her childhood abuse, she was deeply hurt. that's how white feminism works most of the time lmao.
most of the critique regarding this book is related to its main characters. these aren't characters you're supposed to be liking, and that's why a majority of people don't know how to read/interpret this book. i do believe she painted the MeToo movement in bad lighting in a lot of places. but she's a 70-year-old heterosexual white woman so i can't say i didn't go into it not expecting exactly that! men get away with a lot of shit, they need to be held accountable. saying that r@pe is the only bad thing a man can do to a woman? wrong, objectively. power dynamics ensue everywhere and if a man grabs a woman's nipples without asking, that too in a public space, she is expected to go along and laugh and blush. that's what the movement is about, these things are profoundly wrong & can spiral into much worse.
okay book overall, but i do hope men never find this book xx
men really don't know what to do with the power society gives them over women. they're supposed to 'take the lead', but also not ask for consent. it's all fucked.
most of the critique regarding this book is related to its main characters. these aren't characters you're supposed to be liking, and that's why a majority of people don't know how to read/interpret this book. i do believe she painted the MeToo movement in bad lighting in a lot of places. but she's a 70-year-old heterosexual white woman so i can't say i didn't go into it not expecting exactly that! men get away with a lot of shit, they need to be held accountable. saying that r@pe is the only bad thing a man can do to a woman? wrong, objectively. power dynamics ensue everywhere and if a man grabs a woman's nipples without asking, that too in a public space, she is expected to go along and laugh and blush. that's what the movement is about, these things are profoundly wrong & can spiral into much worse.
okay book overall, but i do hope men never find this book xx
Content Warnings
Graphic: Child abuse, Misogyny, Sexual content, and Sexual harassment
thequeenofsheba3's review
challenging
dark
reflective
medium-paced
- Plot- or character-driven? Character
- Strong character development? Yes
- Loveable characters? No
- Diverse cast of characters? It's complicated
- Flaws of characters a main focus? Yes
2.75
Content Warnings
Graphic: Sexual content
Moderate: Sexual harassment, Gaslighting, and Toxic friendship
Minor: Child abuse