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3.82 AVERAGE
3.82 AVERAGE
I've been meaning to read this book, ever since I first spotted it in the bookstore some four or five years back. I finally got round to it a week ago, figuring that there was no better time to read Watching the English while in London. Reading it - as I do all my books - in snatches while commuting, or while waiting in line, I found myself surreptitiously observing the English around me, stifling a chuckle as Fox's observations on queuing (and the English response to queue jumping) and English behaviour on public transport came to life.
This book was a revelation in many ways. Walking around the streets of London, I found myself looking more carefully at the people around me, taking a step back from my own interactions with the English, to try and judge for myself if Fox's observations rang true (her observations on weather talk and grooming talk were especially entertaining). But coming from a former British colony, it was also interesting to read Fox's observations on Home Rules, Dress Codes, Work to Rule, etc and see how some of these rules had been transplanted and operated in another cultural context.
Not everything that Fox writes about - the book was published in 2004 - necessarily still holds true. In her section on pub etiquette for instance, Fox notes that when ordering a drink, it is customary and polite for a customer to ask the publican or bar staff if they will have one for themselves. This is a more discreet way of offering a tip and positions the publican/bar staff as an equal. However, a friend of mine who'd moved to London a couple of years back said her English friends hooted with laughter when told about Fox's advice, noting that nowadays, bar staff would assume you were trying to pick them up if you offered to buy them a drink. Although some of the manifestations of the so-called English rules of behaviour may have changed somewhat - in terms of one's interaction with a publican/bar staff, the kind of vocabulary used, the kind of dress one adopts - the underlying rules that Fox identifies as driving this behaviour are likely to be more stable. In any case, Watching the English is an entertaining read, not only for making one look closer and think harder about why we act the way we do, but also for Fox's oh so English manner of taking the piss out of everything, including herself.
This book was a revelation in many ways. Walking around the streets of London, I found myself looking more carefully at the people around me, taking a step back from my own interactions with the English, to try and judge for myself if Fox's observations rang true (her observations on weather talk and grooming talk were especially entertaining). But coming from a former British colony, it was also interesting to read Fox's observations on Home Rules, Dress Codes, Work to Rule, etc and see how some of these rules had been transplanted and operated in another cultural context.
Not everything that Fox writes about - the book was published in 2004 - necessarily still holds true. In her section on pub etiquette for instance, Fox notes that when ordering a drink, it is customary and polite for a customer to ask the publican or bar staff if they will have one for themselves. This is a more discreet way of offering a tip and positions the publican/bar staff as an equal. However, a friend of mine who'd moved to London a couple of years back said her English friends hooted with laughter when told about Fox's advice, noting that nowadays, bar staff would assume you were trying to pick them up if you offered to buy them a drink. Although some of the manifestations of the so-called English rules of behaviour may have changed somewhat - in terms of one's interaction with a publican/bar staff, the kind of vocabulary used, the kind of dress one adopts - the underlying rules that Fox identifies as driving this behaviour are likely to be more stable. In any case, Watching the English is an entertaining read, not only for making one look closer and think harder about why we act the way we do, but also for Fox's oh so English manner of taking the piss out of everything, including herself.
Not particularly insightful. If the intention is to explain the idiosyncrasies and unique traits of the English, this book fails because it’s just commonplaces about how things happen in society here and all over the anglophone West
I have mixed feelings about this book. For context, I started it back in 2008 just before I left the UK (my country of birth and where I grew up) to move to New Zealand (my new home). Space at a premium back then, it got left behind and it was only last year as the remainder of my possessions finally made the trip overseas that it found itself back on my ‘to be read’ shelves.
If you had to put me on the spot these days I’d classify myself as a ‘Kiwi...who grew up in the UK (that last bit is added on if people question my accent and about half the people I meet these days can’t seem to tell). Has that changed my outlook? Yep. In some ways.
The first few chapters regarding conversation codes are pretty funny and insightful and reminded me a lot of my upbringing. While much of it rung true it highlighted to me how much I’d changed in the last 11 yrs. I could also see an awful lot of my mum’s class insecurities highlighted here as well which I’d never thought too much about.
But. As the book progresses I found myself becoming more agitated and impatient with it. While her style is approachable, it does feel dry at times and there’s an awful lot of repetition, labouring her points again and again. And the more I read, the more I kept asking, ‘where’s the evidence?’.
It felt increasingly generalised with a fairly narrow focus - coming across strongly as a upper middle class, white, south England perspective. I didn’t get much sense of diversity (culturally, ethnically, regionally, sexually) and that’s surely the thing that makes the English so unique compared to many other similar cultures. It’s such a vastly diverse country with such a rich history. It felt like she excluded huge swathes of the population to make the generalisations fit. While I’m sure (and know from experience) that a lot of what she says rings true, it’s not the whole country. England is far more diverse.
And, when it comes to it, she provides very little background, evidence or reference to actually compare any of these traits with other nations (she mainly comments on a few European countries, the colonies, the USA and Japan but ignores pretty much the rest of the world). She just says they’re different. I get it was based on 10 yrs of her own research but 2 of the references she mentions the most are books by Bill Bryson and Jeremy Paxman. This may just be the scientist in me but I like my evidence to be a little more than anecdotal.
Maybe this is all just me being Eeyorish (her reasonably apt term). I do love to moan and over the years I’ve realised this is probably the biggest thing that people from other countries don’t seem to get. They always equate moaning with being unhappy when it’s really not.
Anyway, moaning aside, there is a lot to like, especially in the communication sections and if you are curious as to the meanings behind common social interaction with the English, it’s a reasonable primer. I’m not sure I’d put too much weight on the rest of it though.
If you had to put me on the spot these days I’d classify myself as a ‘Kiwi...who grew up in the UK (that last bit is added on if people question my accent and about half the people I meet these days can’t seem to tell). Has that changed my outlook? Yep. In some ways.
The first few chapters regarding conversation codes are pretty funny and insightful and reminded me a lot of my upbringing. While much of it rung true it highlighted to me how much I’d changed in the last 11 yrs. I could also see an awful lot of my mum’s class insecurities highlighted here as well which I’d never thought too much about.
But. As the book progresses I found myself becoming more agitated and impatient with it. While her style is approachable, it does feel dry at times and there’s an awful lot of repetition, labouring her points again and again. And the more I read, the more I kept asking, ‘where’s the evidence?’.
It felt increasingly generalised with a fairly narrow focus - coming across strongly as a upper middle class, white, south England perspective. I didn’t get much sense of diversity (culturally, ethnically, regionally, sexually) and that’s surely the thing that makes the English so unique compared to many other similar cultures. It’s such a vastly diverse country with such a rich history. It felt like she excluded huge swathes of the population to make the generalisations fit. While I’m sure (and know from experience) that a lot of what she says rings true, it’s not the whole country. England is far more diverse.
And, when it comes to it, she provides very little background, evidence or reference to actually compare any of these traits with other nations (she mainly comments on a few European countries, the colonies, the USA and Japan but ignores pretty much the rest of the world). She just says they’re different. I get it was based on 10 yrs of her own research but 2 of the references she mentions the most are books by Bill Bryson and Jeremy Paxman. This may just be the scientist in me but I like my evidence to be a little more than anecdotal.
Maybe this is all just me being Eeyorish (her reasonably apt term). I do love to moan and over the years I’ve realised this is probably the biggest thing that people from other countries don’t seem to get. They always equate moaning with being unhappy when it’s really not.
Anyway, moaning aside, there is a lot to like, especially in the communication sections and if you are curious as to the meanings behind common social interaction with the English, it’s a reasonable primer. I’m not sure I’d put too much weight on the rest of it though.
funny
informative
reflective
medium-paced
As I am in a period of not necessarily read books cover to cover, I declare myself as "done" with this as I have read approximately 60% of it. Freely skipped chapters on driving (I do not drive), fashion and etiquette (outsourced to Lu. and So.) or having sex with the natives (my wife might have some objections). With this and that I am sure that I did not miss much as the book follows a pattern of what is Englishness which after established becomes the norm for everything else, like if you read the solider rules you will be able to have a good educated guess on the rules of the workplace and vice versa.
If I had to pick on something in this book, my copy is the 2014 revision, is that it perhaps conveniently does not comment on recent changes of the social landscape namely mass immigration (people like me), socialism such as NHS (which stands for "No Health under Socialism" - people unlike me), Political Correctness, 3rd wave femi-nazism and other corroding aspects of the English society and identity. I would like to read something about the state dependency of elements of the not-working class for example. Specially for "work" where many first generation immigrants interact more with locals, there could be some extra content.
The second aspect is that the book is huge, not unnecessarily so though and at times boring perhaps because the author needs to balance her tone between being an academic/scientist and trying to articulate things.
Nevertheless I would suggest to every foreigner that wants to come and stay a bit or perhaps more in our(?) little island to spent some time at least skimming through its pages and familiarize themselves with the norms and manners of these great but oh-so difficult people who I love so much although they have caused me so much trouble. I wish I had read it sooner like in my second or third year here.
(according to the author by reading this I broke at least 3 taboos while I have been "partially infected" with Englishness - time for tea)
If I had to pick on something in this book, my copy is the 2014 revision, is that it perhaps conveniently does not comment on recent changes of the social landscape namely mass immigration (people like me), socialism such as NHS (which stands for "No Health under Socialism" - people unlike me), Political Correctness, 3rd wave femi-nazism and other corroding aspects of the English society and identity. I would like to read something about the state dependency of elements of the not-working class for example. Specially for "work" where many first generation immigrants interact more with locals, there could be some extra content.
The second aspect is that the book is huge, not unnecessarily so though and at times boring perhaps because the author needs to balance her tone between being an academic/scientist and trying to articulate things.
Nevertheless I would suggest to every foreigner that wants to come and stay a bit or perhaps more in our(?) little island to spent some time at least skimming through its pages and familiarize themselves with the norms and manners of these great but oh-so difficult people who I love so much although they have caused me so much trouble. I wish I had read it sooner like in my second or third year here.
(according to the author by reading this I broke at least 3 taboos while I have been "partially infected" with Englishness - time for tea)
A charming yet misfigured look at English social codes.
The peculiarities of English behaviour are so greatly extrapolated that the other side of the Channel sounds almost like a different planet. In practice, a basically well-mannered & polite foreigner with an erudite dash of Anglophilia feels welcome.
Some sections are hard to follow unless you are English. Many habits come off as small town/suburb ideals that don't hold up in the inner big city. And just as many are unfortunate reminders of a still very class-based society, more so than the mainland.
The peculiarities of English behaviour are so greatly extrapolated that the other side of the Channel sounds almost like a different planet. In practice, a basically well-mannered & polite foreigner with an erudite dash of Anglophilia feels welcome.
Some sections are hard to follow unless you are English. Many habits come off as small town/suburb ideals that don't hold up in the inner big city. And just as many are unfortunate reminders of a still very class-based society, more so than the mainland.
I picked this book up in the Frankfurt Airport months ago and I loved it! It's witty and amusing and insightful, especially if you're English, or an Anglophile. She delves into each area of culture and based on observations and a variety of studies attempts to create a series of rules governing how people act. Being an American, it's easy to see how we've inherited some of our colonial mother's habits, and the ways in which we have our own social code stick out as well. It's made me think more about my habits, and why I do them, or feel this way. I've been talking this book up to everyone I know. It was a long read, it's a long book (plus the print in my copy is tiny) and can be a bit heavy, I read fast, and this took me awhile, but it's well worth the time. Highly recommend this book!
Ох, яка цікава і довга подорож! Беззаперечно, рекомендую до прочитання, як мінімум через те, щоб відкрити в собі англійця. І зрозуміти що ж таке з тими англійцями? 😅 Авторка провела колосальну наукову роботу - спостерігаючи за своїми співгромадянами намагалася крекнути код та пояснити всі особливості та причинно-наслідкові залежності поведінки. Вийшло - просто, науково+ з гумором.
I had a tough time with this one. It's meant to be a zippy, quick read about English culture, and it skates over the surface and ignores hard issues. Culture is not a coat to put on and pull off as you see fit, as she claims she could do as a clever young girl. There's a very long history of the English and other colonial powers enforcing their culture overseas, while appropriating, exoticizing and monetizing the products of other nations. The sun still hasn't set on this colonial legacy and I found it troubling that this was in no way meaningfully addressed in almost 600 pages.
Sure has some funny quotes from Northern blokes in it, though.
Sure has some funny quotes from Northern blokes in it, though.