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challenging
dark
tense
medium-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
A mix
Strong character development:
Yes
Loveable characters:
Complicated
Diverse cast of characters:
Yes
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes
I think this was a fitting end to the duology if you can make it to the last pages. I continue to love what Parker-Chan does with gender and power although I think the women do get absolutely pushed to the sidelines here. Unfortunately I found the mid-section to be a bit of a slog of violence and misery. It’s inevitable when you have almost an entire cast of realistically self-hating characters but I still found it really hard to read at times and some of it grew a little repetitive. Zhu, Ma and Xu Da were the lights in the first book and while I found the other characters fascinating; I also think they were drowning too much for me to enjoy following them instead.
Content Warnings
Graphic: Rape, Self harm, Sexism, Sexual assault, Murder, War
dark
slow-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
Character
Strong character development:
Complicated
Loveable characters:
No
Diverse cast of characters:
Complicated
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes
Given the high rating this book has here on SG (4.49 at the time I'm writing this) it has clearly found its audience. That audience does not, unfortunately, include me.
I'll admit that of the Sapphic Saffron Trifecta, I found She Who Became the Sun to be my least favorite. As such, I was really on the fence as to whether to read this one, but I figured hey, it's a duology, I might as well see things through to the end!
This started out as kind of a mid read for me, but I felt like it could get better. The thing is, I do like Zhu as a character. Yes, she does terrible things. But I found her drive and her absolute joy and confidence in her drive to be refreshing. Too often, we have characters who have to be forced to take action, who constantly whine and complain about it...
Like every single other character in this book. Ok, I exaggerate, but I got tired of the constant moping of Ouyang and Wang. Oh, woe is me, life is pain and darkness, I will make the world hate me as much as I hate it, etc etc etc. On and on and on. There were far too few Zhu chapters to make up for it.
At its heart, this is a story about how messed up toxic masculinity is and how people who fail to live up to a culture's idea of manly virtue can be used, abused, despised, and pigeon-holed.
At its heart it's also a book that is just absolutely chock-full of degrading sex, sado-masochism, torturous death, and long internal monologues about anger and self-hatred.
If you like to watch characters suffer, you will enjoy the heck out of this book. The pages are absolutely soaked with suffering. Personally, I just found it exhausting.
I'll admit that of the Sapphic Saffron Trifecta, I found She Who Became the Sun to be my least favorite. As such, I was really on the fence as to whether to read this one, but I figured hey, it's a duology, I might as well see things through to the end!
This started out as kind of a mid read for me, but I felt like it could get better. The thing is, I do like Zhu as a character. Yes, she does terrible things. But I found her drive and her absolute joy and confidence in her drive to be refreshing. Too often, we have characters who have to be forced to take action, who constantly whine and complain about it...
Like every single other character in this book. Ok, I exaggerate, but I got tired of the constant moping of Ouyang and Wang. Oh, woe is me, life is pain and darkness, I will make the world hate me as much as I hate it, etc etc etc. On and on and on. There were far too few Zhu chapters to make up for it.
At its heart, this is a story about how messed up toxic masculinity is and how people who fail to live up to a culture's idea of manly virtue can be used, abused, despised, and pigeon-holed.
At its heart it's also a book that is just absolutely chock-full of degrading sex, sado-masochism, torturous death, and long internal monologues about anger and self-hatred.
If you like to watch characters suffer, you will enjoy the heck out of this book. The pages are absolutely soaked with suffering. Personally, I just found it exhausting.
Content Warnings
Graphic: Ableism, Death, Homophobia, Misogyny, Rape, Sexism, Sexual assault, Sexual content, Sexual violence, Torture, Transphobia, Violence, War, Injury/Injury detail
Moderate: Miscarriage, Fire/Fire injury
Minor: Animal death
adventurous
dark
emotional
inspiring
sad
tense
medium-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
Character
Strong character development:
Yes
Loveable characters:
Yes
Diverse cast of characters:
Yes
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes
Content Warnings
Graphic: Ableism, Body horror, Body shaming, Death, Physical abuse, Self harm, Sexism, Suicidal thoughts, Torture, Violence, Blood, Grief, Murder, War, Injury/Injury detail
Moderate: Child death, Emotional abuse, Gore, Slavery, Kidnapping, Fire/Fire injury
adventurous
challenging
dark
emotional
hopeful
informative
inspiring
mysterious
sad
tense
medium-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
Character
Strong character development:
Yes
Loveable characters:
Yes
Diverse cast of characters:
Yes
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes
Content Warnings
Graphic: Death, Rape, Self harm, Sexism, Sexual violence, Slavery, Suicidal thoughts, Grief, Murder
adventurous
challenging
dark
emotional
funny
sad
tense
medium-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
A mix
Strong character development:
Complicated
Loveable characters:
Complicated
Diverse cast of characters:
Complicated
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes
Shelley Parker-Chan has really knocked it out of the park this time. For anyone who was worried the sequel to She Who Became the Sun wouldn't be as good, or even those who were maybe not as impressed with the first book, I think you will be amazed at He Who Drowned the World.
The book has a bit of a slow start admittedly. It's tough to follow up the ending of the first book and the crazy choices the characters made. But give it a little bit of time to get reinvested in the world and characters and you'll find that Parker-Chan did an incredible job of building off of where she left off. There are more POVs than before, but I didn't mind the inclusions at all. In fact, this book made me truly appreciate Ouyang's character and his downward spiral. All of the different narrators gave such depth to the main themes of loss, ambition, and what it means to be yourself.
We see all these become more and more hyperfocused on their "fates", losing themselves and who they used to be in the process. In some ways, their fervent pursuit of the future is just an extension of their fixation on the past that they can't let go. I was fascinated and horrified with the choices these characters made, that simultaneously a character can be cruel and yet undeserving of the cruelty thrust upon them. Madam Zhang, General Ouyang, Wang Baoxiang, and even our original main character, Zhu Yuanzhang all suffer from the same oppressive forces in society and fight back in their own ways, but more often than not end up working with the society that hurt them as they try to defy it.
If you enjoy character deconstructions, character's descent into self-destruction, and examining the way that a society can hurt different people in the same way, for not belonging or acting within the expectations thrust upon them, this is the book for you.
I also just have to add that my favorite parts were when Ouyang and Zhu interacted, they ended up accidentally being a hilarious comedy duo that really lightened the darker mood of the book haha.
The book has a bit of a slow start admittedly. It's tough to follow up the ending of the first book and the crazy choices the characters made. But give it a little bit of time to get reinvested in the world and characters and you'll find that Parker-Chan did an incredible job of building off of where she left off. There are more POVs than before, but I didn't mind the inclusions at all. In fact, this book made me truly appreciate Ouyang's character and his downward spiral. All of the different narrators gave such depth to the main themes of loss, ambition, and what it means to be yourself.
We see all these become more and more hyperfocused on their "fates", losing themselves and who they used to be in the process. In some ways, their fervent pursuit of the future is just an extension of their fixation on the past that they can't let go. I was fascinated and horrified with the choices these characters made, that simultaneously a character can be cruel and yet undeserving of the cruelty thrust upon them. Madam Zhang, General Ouyang, Wang Baoxiang, and even our original main character, Zhu Yuanzhang all suffer from the same oppressive forces in society and fight back in their own ways, but more often than not end up working with the society that hurt them as they try to defy it.
If you enjoy character deconstructions, character's descent into self-destruction, and examining the way that a society can hurt different people in the same way, for not belonging or acting within the expectations thrust upon them, this is the book for you.
I also just have to add that my favorite parts were when Ouyang and Zhu interacted, they ended up accidentally being a hilarious comedy duo that really lightened the darker mood of the book haha.
Content Warnings
Graphic: Death, Misogyny, Rape, Self harm, Sexism, Sexual assault, Sexual content, Sexual violence, Violence, Grief, Murder, Fire/Fire injury, Sexual harassment, War
Moderate: Body horror, Emotional abuse, Miscarriage, Slavery, Torture, Transphobia, Xenophobia, Vomit, Pregnancy, Outing
adventurous
dark
emotional
tense
medium-paced
Just when you thought the stakes couldn't get higher, Parker-Chan raised them with more political intrigue and a surprising amount of darkness that will have you on the edge of your seat. There are more perspectives we're getting in this sequel to really reveal the complex web that the author crafted. Parker-Chan seized this opportunity and did a phenomenal job fleshing out fascinating, morally grey characters, many of them changing a fair bit compared to She Who Became the Sun.
Once again, Parker-Chan dives deep into gender and sexuality, though I felt there was more discussion on femininity in the sequel than in the first book, which was refreshing. I think more could have been done on this front, especially considering that we got more of Ma's and Madam Zhang's perspectives on ongoing politics and scheming, though I didn't think it was unsatisfying either— I absolutely loved that the author continued to explore (toxic) masculinity. I was especially invested in Baoxiang's perspective and the way he negotiated with his own sexuality.
In the first novel, I didn't feel the fantastical elements worked particularly well. I think this was attended to rather well in the sequel, and the ghostly elements really did add a lot to the story (particularly towards the end).
Parker-Chan did a fantastic job wrapping up a strong duology. Despite the significant losses and violence in He Who Drowned the World, it all played out well like a high stakes chess game that you can't help but feel invested in.
Content Warnings
Graphic: Death, Misogyny, Rape, Self harm, Sexism, Sexual assault, Violence, Blood, War
Moderate: Ableism, Homophobia
adventurous
challenging
dark
emotional
sad
slow-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
Character
Strong character development:
Complicated
Loveable characters:
Complicated
Diverse cast of characters:
Yes
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes
Mild spoilers included:
This is the grim follow-up to She Who Became the Sun. The main POV cast is expanded to four people: Zhu, Oyuang, Baoxiang, and Madam Zhang. Oyuang and Baoxiang were the characters I found to be the most compelling from the first book (I love those tragic, self-hating, revenge-seeking dangerous characters) so I really enjoyed them having a larger part of the narrative.
One of the things I really appreciate is how very queer this book is, Zhu is an asexual nonbinary person. Oyuang is a (possibly gay) cis man considered by others to be Not A Man because he’s a eunuch. Baoxiang is a flamboyant cishet man who nevertheless regularly sleeps with a man to further his goals. It a messy sort of queer rep that doesn’t fit into the neat boxes I’m used to seeing in other books.
On the other hand, just like in the first book, I found Zhu to be something of a weak point. The way she views the world as though success is a forgone conclusion, her optimism, her blind determination just isn’t particularly interesting, it often feels one-note. The far more angsty, sacrificing, and self-destructive paths that Oyuang and Baoxiang take is really what I most enjoy about this series. It looked like Zhu was going to become a clear villain type character at the end of the first book but she took on more of an anti-hero role in this book which I felt was a bit of a letdown. In contrast, Oyuang really stole the show, he’s at his best when he’s being his worst and I loved every scene he was in.
Overall I did enjoy this more than the first book, it’s an Everybody Makes Bad Choices type book. Sometimes it’s fun just to watch bad people do bad things. Thanks to NetGalley and the publisher for this audiobook ARC.
This is the grim follow-up to She Who Became the Sun. The main POV cast is expanded to four people: Zhu, Oyuang, Baoxiang, and Madam Zhang. Oyuang and Baoxiang were the characters I found to be the most compelling from the first book (I love those tragic, self-hating, revenge-seeking dangerous characters) so I really enjoyed them having a larger part of the narrative.
One of the things I really appreciate is how very queer this book is, Zhu is an asexual nonbinary person. Oyuang is a (possibly gay) cis man considered by others to be Not A Man because he’s a eunuch. Baoxiang is a flamboyant cishet man who nevertheless regularly sleeps with a man to further his goals. It a messy sort of queer rep that doesn’t fit into the neat boxes I’m used to seeing in other books.
On the other hand, just like in the first book, I found Zhu to be something of a weak point. The way she views the world as though success is a forgone conclusion, her optimism, her blind determination just isn’t particularly interesting, it often feels one-note. The far more angsty, sacrificing, and self-destructive paths that Oyuang and Baoxiang take is really what I most enjoy about this series. It looked like Zhu was going to become a clear villain type character at the end of the first book but she took on more of an anti-hero role in this book which I felt was a bit of a letdown. In contrast, Oyuang really stole the show, he’s at his best when he’s being his worst and I loved every scene he was in.
Overall I did enjoy this more than the first book, it’s an Everybody Makes Bad Choices type book. Sometimes it’s fun just to watch bad people do bad things. Thanks to NetGalley and the publisher for this audiobook ARC.
Content Warnings
Graphic: Death, Homophobia, Rape, Self harm, Sexism, Sexual assault, Torture, Transphobia, Violence
Moderate: Pregnancy
challenging
dark
emotional
tense
medium-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
A mix
Strong character development:
Yes
Loveable characters:
Complicated
Diverse cast of characters:
Yes
Content Warnings
Graphic: Child death, Misogyny, Rape, Sexism, Sexual assault, Sexual content, Sexual violence, Torture, Transphobia, Murder, War, Injury/Injury detail
adventurous
dark
emotional
tense
medium-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
A mix
Strong character development:
Yes
Loveable characters:
Complicated
Diverse cast of characters:
Yes
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes
Content Warnings
Graphic: Confinement, Death, Domestic abuse, Gore, Misogyny, Self harm, Sexism, Torture, Violence, Grief, Murder, Fire/Fire injury, War, Injury/Injury detail, Classism
Moderate: Ableism, Animal cruelty, Child death, Homophobia, Infidelity, Rape, Sexual assault, Sexual content, Slavery, Suicidal thoughts, Transphobia, Xenophobia, Medical content, Death of parent, Dysphoria
Minor: Incest, Miscarriage, Suicide, Vomit, Abortion
adventurous
challenging
dark
tense
fast-paced
I’m not sure I have the brain space to create an accurate review, but here are some thoughts. I really liked this book. A lot. However, I wanted to quit a couple times in the first quarter cause, while listening to the audiobook, I got confused about/ couldn’t keep track of all the characters quite a few times. I had this problem with the first book a few times too, so I persevered. It was totally worth it, but I do wish the publishers had included a PDF of the characters as a reference.
There is quite a bit of self loathing/ self harm throughout the story, and a lot of homophobia. Particularly a misogynistic hatred of men loving men and men presenting with any femininity. I had some questions for the author, particularly around the homophobia, but I’ll have to listen again sometime to check my impressions.
Recommended, with these CW.
There is quite a bit of self loathing/ self harm throughout the story, and a lot of homophobia. Particularly a misogynistic hatred of men loving men and men presenting with any femininity. I had some questions for the author, particularly around the homophobia, but I’ll have to listen again sometime to check my impressions.
Recommended, with these CW.
Content Warnings
Graphic: Ableism, Death, Homophobia, Misogyny, Self harm, Sexism, Murder, War, Classism
Moderate: Sexual assault, Toxic relationship