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I'm so glad I found another more readable version of this story than the collection of poems/verses in older english I originally bought. I was gutted when I tried to read through that version. It was so dense and drained me from joy reading it! One day I might fight my way through the actual poems as I do like to use my brain occasionally, but for now I appreaciate the readability of this other translation. Note that I'm not really into poems and plays as such. I do try to venture into them occasionally. However in this case it didn't work out at all, so thank whoever for another version of this great ancient story.
adventurous
dark
medium-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
Plot
Strong character development:
Complicated
Loveable characters:
Complicated
Diverse cast of characters:
Complicated
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes
adventurous
challenging
funny
informative
tense
slow-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
A mix
Strong character development:
Yes
Loveable characters:
Complicated
Diverse cast of characters:
N/A
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes
I'm not sure exactly where my thoughts sit with this one, though I have some rapid fire ones that I can easily get off:
- where's the horse ((I didn't realize that this book didn't cover the end of the war))
- I didn't realize how absent Achilles and Patroclus are for so much
- 'that's my bestie <3' every time Odysseus was mentioned
- Dawn is personified as more than just 'rosy-fingered' (like in The Odyssey) though words often flew on wings ((I will be trying to look up why or wrestle with that myself, if I can't find anything, bc I find it such an interesting phrase that likely means a lot in Ancient Greek culture))
I think this book is even more an interesting reflection in the changes in storytelling between Ancient Greece and today than The Odyssey was - referring back to my comment about not realizing prior to reading The Iliad that it only covers a handful of days - and isn't a recount of the end of the war or even the beginning: the story itself feels incomplete, seeming to speak to a collaborative culture of oral stories that get told by many people at many times in many ways but always trying to keep the heart the same ((also, arguably, the ancestor of translation [and that is a direct reference to the Wilson vs other translators discourse that had bene going on around the time of Nolan's Odyssey movie announcement])). There were plot threads mentioned or begun that never dissolve in the 500ish pages of actual story (the back matter is a beast with notes and a glossary, so progress felt very slow looking at page count); this is, of course, not a critique of the translator or Homer or even the story itself. Still, I find myself disappointed at not seeing some of the more iconic moments of greek mythology that pervade pop culture, though I'm not mad at what I have gotten. Though, admittedly, I'm not as keen on this one as I am on the Odyssey ((I just personally don't connect with as many themes in the Iliad)).
The Iliad is also a lot gorier than I had initially expected; while I knew it was about the Trojan War, I was surprised by how brutally war was actually portrayed. I also found the first few chapters mind-numbing in how they're essentially just rosters of who killed whom with backstory for both killer and killed often accompanying the vivid description of death (though I do appreciate how these moments humanized the victims and impressed that they were human with their own lives and legacies and not just nameless canon fodder in what feels like a meaningless war - it made the deaths feel more visceral and real, even if I still didn't really care about them on any deeply personal level).
(((okay so maybe I did have some actual thoughts to share)))
- where's the horse ((I didn't realize that this book didn't cover the end of the war))
- I didn't realize how absent Achilles and Patroclus are for so much
- 'that's my bestie <3' every time Odysseus was mentioned
- Dawn is personified as more than just 'rosy-fingered' (like in The Odyssey) though words often flew on wings ((I will be trying to look up why or wrestle with that myself, if I can't find anything, bc I find it such an interesting phrase that likely means a lot in Ancient Greek culture))
I think this book is even more an interesting reflection in the changes in storytelling between Ancient Greece and today than The Odyssey was - referring back to my comment about not realizing prior to reading The Iliad that it only covers a handful of days - and isn't a recount of the end of the war or even the beginning: the story itself feels incomplete, seeming to speak to a collaborative culture of oral stories that get told by many people at many times in many ways but always trying to keep the heart the same ((also, arguably, the ancestor of translation [and that is a direct reference to the Wilson vs other translators discourse that had bene going on around the time of Nolan's Odyssey movie announcement])). There were plot threads mentioned or begun that never dissolve in the 500ish pages of actual story (the back matter is a beast with notes and a glossary, so progress felt very slow looking at page count); this is, of course, not a critique of the translator or Homer or even the story itself. Still, I find myself disappointed at not seeing some of the more iconic moments of greek mythology that pervade pop culture, though I'm not mad at what I have gotten. Though, admittedly, I'm not as keen on this one as I am on the Odyssey ((I just personally don't connect with as many themes in the Iliad)).
The Iliad is also a lot gorier than I had initially expected; while I knew it was about the Trojan War, I was surprised by how brutally war was actually portrayed. I also found the first few chapters mind-numbing in how they're essentially just rosters of who killed whom with backstory for both killer and killed often accompanying the vivid description of death (though I do appreciate how these moments humanized the victims and impressed that they were human with their own lives and legacies and not just nameless canon fodder in what feels like a meaningless war - it made the deaths feel more visceral and real, even if I still didn't really care about them on any deeply personal level).
(((okay so maybe I did have some actual thoughts to share)))
2 de 4 estrelas.
2025-04-24 — lido HOMERO. Ilíada. Tradução do grego 'Iλιάς, Nota prévia e posfácio por Trajano Vieira. A Ilíada ou o poema da força, traduzido por André Telles do francês L'Iliade ou le Poème de la Force, por Simone Weil. Texto de orelha por Rachel Bespaloff e excertos da crítica de Mark W. Edwards, Adam Parry, Norman Austin, Bernard Knox, Hermann Fränkel, James Redfield, Joachim Latacz, Eric A. Havelock e George Steiner traduzidos por Danilo Hora. 1. ed. São Paulo: 34, 2020. 1048 p. ISBN 978-65-5525-005-3. Nota: li todas as páginas em português e a primeira página em grego, mas não as demais 463 páginas em grego. Média de 1,81 página por dia.
Eu tinha lido uma adaptação da Ilíada para prosa, pela Ediouro, para a disciplina de Cultura Clássica do Colégio, no distante ano de 1987. Estimulado pelas aulas do Alex Castro (que aliás disse que aquela adaptação era "lixo"), resolvi relê-la como se deve.
A Ilíada é um poema épico ambientado na Idade do Bronze, presumìvelmente no século XII a.C. ou antes. Supostamente composto no século VIII a.C. e atribuído a Homero, poeta grego, itinerante e cego, o poema passou muitos anos sendo declamado oralmente, até que foi reduzido a termo. Narra eventos passados no décimo dos dez anos da Guerra de Troia, quando Aquiles, líder guerreiro aqueu, é ofendido por seu comandante, Agamêmnon, e por isso se retira do combate. Os aqueus passam a perder a guerra, e os troianos chegam a invadir seu acampamento. Pátroclo, amigo íntimo de Aquiles, dispõe-se a substituí-lo mas acaba morto por Heitor, príncipe e comandante do exército de Troia. Aquiles enfurece-se, enfrenta o exército troiano sòzinho e mata Heitor. Ao fim, o rei de Troia, Príamo, vem resgatar o corpo de seu filho.
A história parece simples, mas o poema é extenso, complexo e recheado de digressões que nos mostram a mitologia grega, o modo de pensar da sociedade grega daquela época, suas instituições, seus valores, suas crenças e seus costumes. Apesar de narrar sucessivos atos de coragem e heroísmo, uma das principais lições da Ilíada é que os homens estão sempre sujeitos aos caprichos imprevisíveis e volúveis dos deuses e a um destino inevitável e frequentemente trágico.
A tradução de Trajano Vieira desrespeita muito a gramática e inventa neologismos tolos. Como eu já havia lido a tradução de Frederico Lourenço (mais objetiva, mais rigorosa e muito melhor), e lhe dado três estrelinhas, fica Trajano com duas de quatro.
2025-04-24 — lido HOMERO. Ilíada. Tradução do grego 'Iλιάς, Nota prévia e posfácio por Trajano Vieira. A Ilíada ou o poema da força, traduzido por André Telles do francês L'Iliade ou le Poème de la Force, por Simone Weil. Texto de orelha por Rachel Bespaloff e excertos da crítica de Mark W. Edwards, Adam Parry, Norman Austin, Bernard Knox, Hermann Fränkel, James Redfield, Joachim Latacz, Eric A. Havelock e George Steiner traduzidos por Danilo Hora. 1. ed. São Paulo: 34, 2020. 1048 p. ISBN 978-65-5525-005-3. Nota: li todas as páginas em português e a primeira página em grego, mas não as demais 463 páginas em grego. Média de 1,81 página por dia.
Eu tinha lido uma adaptação da Ilíada para prosa, pela Ediouro, para a disciplina de Cultura Clássica do Colégio, no distante ano de 1987. Estimulado pelas aulas do Alex Castro (que aliás disse que aquela adaptação era "lixo"), resolvi relê-la como se deve.
A Ilíada é um poema épico ambientado na Idade do Bronze, presumìvelmente no século XII a.C. ou antes. Supostamente composto no século VIII a.C. e atribuído a Homero, poeta grego, itinerante e cego, o poema passou muitos anos sendo declamado oralmente, até que foi reduzido a termo. Narra eventos passados no décimo dos dez anos da Guerra de Troia, quando Aquiles, líder guerreiro aqueu, é ofendido por seu comandante, Agamêmnon, e por isso se retira do combate. Os aqueus passam a perder a guerra, e os troianos chegam a invadir seu acampamento. Pátroclo, amigo íntimo de Aquiles, dispõe-se a substituí-lo mas acaba morto por Heitor, príncipe e comandante do exército de Troia. Aquiles enfurece-se, enfrenta o exército troiano sòzinho e mata Heitor. Ao fim, o rei de Troia, Príamo, vem resgatar o corpo de seu filho.
A história parece simples, mas o poema é extenso, complexo e recheado de digressões que nos mostram a mitologia grega, o modo de pensar da sociedade grega daquela época, suas instituições, seus valores, suas crenças e seus costumes. Apesar de narrar sucessivos atos de coragem e heroísmo, uma das principais lições da Ilíada é que os homens estão sempre sujeitos aos caprichos imprevisíveis e volúveis dos deuses e a um destino inevitável e frequentemente trágico.
A tradução de Trajano Vieira desrespeita muito a gramática e inventa neologismos tolos. Como eu já havia lido a tradução de Frederico Lourenço (mais objetiva, mais rigorosa e muito melhor), e lhe dado três estrelinhas, fica Trajano com duas de quatro.
adventurous
challenging
emotional
sad
fast-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
A mix
Strong character development:
Complicated
Loveable characters:
Complicated
Diverse cast of characters:
Yes
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes
At its best a mesmerizing above/below drama between humans and gods. You think it's only about war until you don't. It's a poem obsessed with boundaries and liminal spaces, its (anti?) hero a fighter who resides in the margins before he careens through the story like a banshee. The introduction alone is worth the price of admission.
adventurous
informative
slow-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
A mix
Strong character development:
No
Loveable characters:
No
Diverse cast of characters:
No
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes
Looks like Gods don’t have a better character than human beings.
adventurous
challenging
slow-paced
Plot or Character Driven:
A mix
Strong character development:
Complicated
Loveable characters:
Complicated
Diverse cast of characters:
No
Flaws of characters a main focus:
Yes