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158 reviews for:
Parenting with Love and Logic: Teaching Children Responsibility
Foster Cline, Jim Fay
3.75 AVERAGE
158 reviews for:
Parenting with Love and Logic: Teaching Children Responsibility
Foster Cline, Jim Fay
3.75 AVERAGE
Sound principles for allowing children to learn to choose for themselves. Sometimes we have to manipulate consequences if the natural consequences will harm someone or something or if the natural consequences will not be effective teachers. For example, don't let your toddler experience the natural consequence of running into a busy street but instead contrive an acceptable consequence like a toddler leash for the rest of the time outside or they can't play outside for the rest of the afternoon or some other consequence related to the misbehavior of running away from safety. And the natural consequences of a bad grade resulting from poor planning, while painful for the parents who want their kids to get good grades, is a valuable learning opportunity for the child who also wants good grades but needs to learn that good planning is important to that process. Obviously, if the kid doesn't care about good grades, the parent would devise other consequences to help the child want to work harder. For example, the child has a choice to work harder in school or lose extracurricular activities that he/she values. The book also advises empathy and compassion while guiding children through their choices and consequences. The point of the book is to show parents the value and mechanics of natural and contrived consequences in order to teach children how to make choices that will enable them to be successful in life. Any mentioned examples are examples only, not intended for rote repetition in a real situation. I noticed some reviewers got all huffy over the examples given, completely missing the point of the the general principles the examples were demonstrating. The choices should all be given within the bounds the parents have set. The book is not suggesting a parent allow a kid to stay up all night if they choose, if the parent is not willing to let that happen. Anyway, I am on a soapbox. I believe the general principles are sound, even if I don't necessarily agree with their specific examples.
I first heard about this book from Jordan Page, which got me interested in reading it.
I feel this book has a lot of good philosophies in it, and I've applied several of them into my daily parenting. My one squabble is I feel that a lot of the wording they give as examples to use seems really wonky and not life-like or toddler friendly sometimes. Q
I feel this book has a lot of good philosophies in it, and I've applied several of them into my daily parenting. My one squabble is I feel that a lot of the wording they give as examples to use seems really wonky and not life-like or toddler friendly sometimes. Q
As many other reviewers have said, you should take from this book what's useful to you and leave the rest. A few useful things for me:
1. Parenting should not be a power struggle. My job as a parent is not to control my child. (This is not in the book, but I really like partnering/collaborating with my 5yo to find solutions to conflicts. As the book says, kids should have opportunities to exercise power over their lives.)
2. Keep in mind your ultimate goal as a parent. For most of us, it's for our kids to become independent and trustworthy. This can't happen if we never trust them. We have to give them opportunities to make choices and suffer consequences within reason.
3. Be consistent with boundaries. This is especially important for very young children who don't understand how context guides behavior. For example, if you let your child make a big mess and laugh about it one day (because, say, it's a lazy Sunday) but then the next day you get super upset when they make a big mess (because, say, it's Monday morning and you have to get to work) it's confusing for little kids. Consistency (to the point of even saying "uh-oh" in the same sing-song way every time you want to discourage a behavior) will really help guide behavior.
A few things the book advocates that don't work for me:
1. Don't lecture. --okay, this sounds good. But the authors recommend parents keep mum and let experience be their child's teacher. This doesn't always work for me because I'm a verbal person raising a verbal kid. Some things are better learned first by talking together. For example, if we're having a conflict over toothbrushing, I'm not going to quietly let my kids get cavities so they can learn from experience why toothbrushing matters. I'm going to describe in detail how much it sucks to get a cavity and explain that a trip to the dentist is expensive. (This has worked pretty well for us, btw.)
2. Never lose your cool. --again this sounds good. But it basically encourages parents to trick kids into thinking the kids have no power to upset their parents. I think this will inevitably come across as hollow as your kids get older. I'd rather be authentic with my kid about my feelings. Honestly, I don't think I could pull off unflappable anyway.
3. Lock your kid in their room when they misbehave because you can't control their behavior but you can control their location. --yeah, this is bad advice. Please don't routinely lock your child in their room, even if you're standing just outside the door. Google "love withdrawal" as a parenting/discipline technique and you'll find research that shows this doesn't work well.
1. Parenting should not be a power struggle. My job as a parent is not to control my child. (This is not in the book, but I really like partnering/collaborating with my 5yo to find solutions to conflicts. As the book says, kids should have opportunities to exercise power over their lives.)
2. Keep in mind your ultimate goal as a parent. For most of us, it's for our kids to become independent and trustworthy. This can't happen if we never trust them. We have to give them opportunities to make choices and suffer consequences within reason.
3. Be consistent with boundaries. This is especially important for very young children who don't understand how context guides behavior. For example, if you let your child make a big mess and laugh about it one day (because, say, it's a lazy Sunday) but then the next day you get super upset when they make a big mess (because, say, it's Monday morning and you have to get to work) it's confusing for little kids. Consistency (to the point of even saying "uh-oh" in the same sing-song way every time you want to discourage a behavior) will really help guide behavior.
A few things the book advocates that don't work for me:
1. Don't lecture. --okay, this sounds good. But the authors recommend parents keep mum and let experience be their child's teacher. This doesn't always work for me because I'm a verbal person raising a verbal kid. Some things are better learned first by talking together. For example, if we're having a conflict over toothbrushing, I'm not going to quietly let my kids get cavities so they can learn from experience why toothbrushing matters. I'm going to describe in detail how much it sucks to get a cavity and explain that a trip to the dentist is expensive. (This has worked pretty well for us, btw.)
2. Never lose your cool. --again this sounds good. But it basically encourages parents to trick kids into thinking the kids have no power to upset their parents. I think this will inevitably come across as hollow as your kids get older. I'd rather be authentic with my kid about my feelings. Honestly, I don't think I could pull off unflappable anyway.
3. Lock your kid in their room when they misbehave because you can't control their behavior but you can control their location. --yeah, this is bad advice. Please don't routinely lock your child in their room, even if you're standing just outside the door. Google "love withdrawal" as a parenting/discipline technique and you'll find research that shows this doesn't work well.
Like a lot of parenting books, this had some good pointers and suggestions, and some things that I didn't necessarily agree with. I did like a lot of things in this book because I have one child in particular that a lot of the principles I think may help. Each child is different and different things work for each one, so I don't know if this is a style I'd suggest for everyone. But I definitely got some good ideas and things that I'm trying to implement with my children.
While I really liked the ideas in this book, I'm giving it 4 stars because I felt like it wasn't organized well and didn't really give a clear plan of how to actually implement the ideas.
Reread (2017) This time I would give it 3 stars. It feels like the authors have the attitude that if you would follow the ideas in the book, your kids will be perfect...which works great, until you have a kid who doesn't fit the traditional mold. I do think there are a lot of good ideas in here, but I don't think one method will work for every kid.
Reread (2017) This time I would give it 3 stars. It feels like the authors have the attitude that if you would follow the ideas in the book, your kids will be perfect...which works great, until you have a kid who doesn't fit the traditional mold. I do think there are a lot of good ideas in here, but I don't think one method will work for every kid.
informative
slow-paced
The people who are making absurd comments about the book encouraging abuse and neglect missed the point. It's about letting kids learn responsibility when the stakes are low. One missed meal because of bad behavior does not lead to starvation. One trip outside without a coat does not lead to hypothermia. One day of tardiness to school does not lead to legal action from the school district. I have a feeling that some of those complaining are the helicopter parents who make things worse for their children by rescuing them constantly. Advise, guide, and let the children learn from the consequences of their actions, both positive and negative.
This book was the oldest book on my to-read list; I've owned a hardcover version since January 2016. I forget how I came across it, but I knew at least one other parent who liked it. I ended-up checking out the Audio CD version from my library and finished it in less than 6 days (audible didn't have this title).
I gave this book 4 stars because 75% of the content was 5-star worthy, and 25% was 1-star worthy. In the 5-star was the core idea of letting thoughtful consequences be the "punishment" for undesirable behavior. In the 1-star was an oversimplification of harder issues like dealing with trauma, tragedy, drugs and divorce. The book was first published in 1990 and I had the "Updated and Expanded Edition" from 2006, but the author only explicitly said they changed their minds on one thing -- spanking (now discouraged). But it is due for an update on its topics of screen time and smart phones.
Where the book excels is giving parents short, scripted responses to circumvent repetitive or unproductive conversations with your kids, and addressing a variety of common scenarios. It does say these conversations take practice and time, which is in line with how I teach safety conversations to encourage thinking and ultimately change behavior. Another cool bonus topic toward the end of the book was teaching your kids your values, which he says happens one of two ways: (1) by actions your kids witness you taking, or (2) in your interactions directly with them. What is unsaid here is that just speaking and repeating your values is insufficient. I agree most of the time, but I do specifically remember my mom saying "I hate liars" and that has stuck with me (and my brother) ever since.
The book is split into tips in the first part, and "pearls" in the second part. The first section is better than the second. I am considering buying copies for my siblings after I find out what format they would prefer. I haven't read many parenting books but, despite its flaws, this one is at the top of my list. I hope a younger author picks up the theories/program and releases a modernized version. It is encouraging to see they have a robust website with classes, webinars, YouTube videos and conferences.
I gave this book 4 stars because 75% of the content was 5-star worthy, and 25% was 1-star worthy. In the 5-star was the core idea of letting thoughtful consequences be the "punishment" for undesirable behavior. In the 1-star was an oversimplification of harder issues like dealing with trauma, tragedy, drugs and divorce. The book was first published in 1990 and I had the "Updated and Expanded Edition" from 2006, but the author only explicitly said they changed their minds on one thing -- spanking (now discouraged). But it is due for an update on its topics of screen time and smart phones.
Where the book excels is giving parents short, scripted responses to circumvent repetitive or unproductive conversations with your kids, and addressing a variety of common scenarios. It does say these conversations take practice and time, which is in line with how I teach safety conversations to encourage thinking and ultimately change behavior. Another cool bonus topic toward the end of the book was teaching your kids your values, which he says happens one of two ways: (1) by actions your kids witness you taking, or (2) in your interactions directly with them. What is unsaid here is that just speaking and repeating your values is insufficient. I agree most of the time, but I do specifically remember my mom saying "I hate liars" and that has stuck with me (and my brother) ever since.
The book is split into tips in the first part, and "pearls" in the second part. The first section is better than the second. I am considering buying copies for my siblings after I find out what format they would prefer. I haven't read many parenting books but, despite its flaws, this one is at the top of my list. I hope a younger author picks up the theories/program and releases a modernized version. It is encouraging to see they have a robust website with classes, webinars, YouTube videos and conferences.
emotional
funny
informative
inspiring
slow-paced
I have mixed feelings about this book.
Here’s what I liked about this book:
* The emphasis on consequences. It makes sense that, in order to learn about the real world, children should be allowed to experience consequences (within reason) so they can alter their behavior. And consequences cannot be given unless choices are also offered, within reason. I agree with that, too.
* Also, I loved that they pointed out several times how important it is to model good behavior for your children. I wholeheartedly agree!
And now, the juicy stuff. Here’s what I didn’t like:
* I’m a mom to a two-year-old, not a teenager — but they rarely seem to preface which age bracket would apply to certain scenarios. Obviously, the section titled “Pacifiers” was meant for toddlers (and thank HEAVENS Logan weaned off the pacifier a few months ago, or I probably would have ended up in tears over that chapter), but as for some of the other situations, I wasn’t sure. There is a specific “Love and Logic” book geared especially for toddlers, but it’s not at my public library, and after reading this one I’m not sure I want to hunt it down.
* Also, some of the sample dialogue of a parent with a child was hard to read without sarcasm — hardly very “loving.” They did warn against sarcasm in a chapter tucked away in the middle of the book, but to avoid it completely might be hard for parents. Phrases like “gee, son, I’m sorry that you got a D on your report card; that’s a real bummer” or “nice try, son, but you’ll have to think of another solution” could be said with love, but just parroting the book isn’t going to cut it (in fact, it could easily morph into one of the most unloving things you could say). Maybe this says more about me than about the book, but a lot of that sample dialogue made the parents out to be snide and manipulative.
* Lastly: I don’t really agree with how they say we should teach our kids about money. I went to a class during BYU Education Week that was a little off-beat on the whole allowance issue, saying that kids need less emphasis on learning money management and more emphasis on learning generosity. I tend to agree with that school of thought (though how exactly I want to implement that, I’m not sure yet). This book, though, took the money management thing to the extreme. Example: kids who wouldn’t eat what was made for dinner are consequently allowed to help themselves to something from the fridge — but ONLY if they paid for the food out of their allowances. I guess the thinking is that that the parents had already paid for one meal as part of their parental duties.
There are some good ideas to be taken from this book, but I think the kind of parent who would pick this book up is the parent who’s already doing a lot of the “good stuff” and probably doesn’t need a book to pick up on it.
Here’s what I liked about this book:
* The emphasis on consequences. It makes sense that, in order to learn about the real world, children should be allowed to experience consequences (within reason) so they can alter their behavior. And consequences cannot be given unless choices are also offered, within reason. I agree with that, too.
* Also, I loved that they pointed out several times how important it is to model good behavior for your children. I wholeheartedly agree!
And now, the juicy stuff. Here’s what I didn’t like:
* I’m a mom to a two-year-old, not a teenager — but they rarely seem to preface which age bracket would apply to certain scenarios. Obviously, the section titled “Pacifiers” was meant for toddlers (and thank HEAVENS Logan weaned off the pacifier a few months ago, or I probably would have ended up in tears over that chapter), but as for some of the other situations, I wasn’t sure. There is a specific “Love and Logic” book geared especially for toddlers, but it’s not at my public library, and after reading this one I’m not sure I want to hunt it down.
* Also, some of the sample dialogue of a parent with a child was hard to read without sarcasm — hardly very “loving.” They did warn against sarcasm in a chapter tucked away in the middle of the book, but to avoid it completely might be hard for parents. Phrases like “gee, son, I’m sorry that you got a D on your report card; that’s a real bummer” or “nice try, son, but you’ll have to think of another solution” could be said with love, but just parroting the book isn’t going to cut it (in fact, it could easily morph into one of the most unloving things you could say). Maybe this says more about me than about the book, but a lot of that sample dialogue made the parents out to be snide and manipulative.
* Lastly: I don’t really agree with how they say we should teach our kids about money. I went to a class during BYU Education Week that was a little off-beat on the whole allowance issue, saying that kids need less emphasis on learning money management and more emphasis on learning generosity. I tend to agree with that school of thought (though how exactly I want to implement that, I’m not sure yet). This book, though, took the money management thing to the extreme. Example: kids who wouldn’t eat what was made for dinner are consequently allowed to help themselves to something from the fridge — but ONLY if they paid for the food out of their allowances. I guess the thinking is that that the parents had already paid for one meal as part of their parental duties.
There are some good ideas to be taken from this book, but I think the kind of parent who would pick this book up is the parent who’s already doing a lot of the “good stuff” and probably doesn’t need a book to pick up on it.